Rob welcomes back Michael Bailey to the cabin to discuss TALES TO ASTONISH #12 starring The Sub-Mariner!
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Another fun episode. All those reprint issues were an important part of our “comic history lessons”. Marvel Tales when it started reprinting the early Spider-Man issues gave me a real appreciation for early Marvel.
I have vivid memories of “Drak Pack: they were teenage versions of Dracula; Frankenstein’s monster and the werewolf doing super hero stuff with their “monster” powers. Strangely, the werewolf had super breath. And the vampire could turn into a cloud? I don’t remember a single story plot, but it probably didn’t matter.
Excellent conversation, gentlemen. On the topic of the newer, late ’70s/early ’80s reprint titles, regardless of the backroom reasons for doing them were, the young me loved them. As a diehard X-fan, I was loving the reprints of the early X-men in Amazing Adventures, while the reprints of Sub-mariner in Tales to Astonish, together with the reprints of Silver Surfer in the revived Fantasy Masterpieces, were particular favorites because of all the lovely John Buscema art. No offense to Marie Severin (of whose work I became a big fan later), but I dropped Tales to Astonish once the Buscema-drawn issues were over. Of course, as you noted, Marvel pulled the plug on it not long afterward anyway…
Also, I was another fan of Drak Pack. Although I hardly remember the details of any single episode now, I watched it pretty religiously back then. And it included what I still think is the best ever acronym for an association of evil doers: O.G.R.E., standing for “Organization of Generally Rotten Enterprises.” Chef’s kiss.
Aquaman had two O.G.R.E, groups, the best of which was the Organization for General Revenge and Enslavement.
A very entertaining episode. My favourite reprint comic was Marvel Tales. I also loved World’s Greatest Comics (it was a bit before my time, but back issues were readily available at trade-in stores).
Thanks for another exciting episode. Maybe that cover image was flipped so Namor’s foot didn’t fall behind the UPC box. And speaking of feet, for a scary monster, that beastie on the cover would make a great bottle opener.
I wasn’t a fan of Namor, he was such a pompous arse, although he had great art from the likes of Adam Austin/Gene Colan, Marie Severin and, of course, Bill Everett. And some of his villains were fun, and I liked Namorita. It’s funny that Marvel put him in a team with the equally pompous Dr Strange and Silver Surfer, they should have called them The Unbearables.
Andy may pipe up with information – I hope so! – but I’d certainly never heard of the name John Fuller as regards Marvel UK. Looking at the artwork on that Vision back-up I wouldn’t be surprised if they were ALL Neal Adams swipes. I didn’t know Marvel UK was doing new stories other than the likes of Star Wars tie-ins and Captain Britain etcetera. US-style Marvel stories such as this were not at all common in Marvel UK – Hulk Weekly had Hulk, Black Knight/Captain Britain, Nick Fury, Nightraven and more, but that experiment was pretty much dead within a year, and those stories were UK-adventure weekly style, with many panels per page. I’d love to know the story behind this oddity. I wouldn’t be surprised were it not prepped by Marvel US because someone saw such a hole coming, and meanwhile they offered it to Marvel UK – which we’re almost always printed in black and white – to give their readers a treat.
Michael, do read the two Vision and Scarlet Witch limited series, they are excellent – especially the second by Steve Engelhart and DC stalwart Richard Howell.
Knowing that the reprints in Giants, Spectaculars and the like meant DC didn’t have to pay anyone for new stories didn’t take away from my enjoyment at all. Writers and artists had already been paid for the work, they weren’t having to do the job again. Companies needed to make a profit so they could continue to commission new work. No problem. Like everyone else, I ate the reprints up.
As regards the Invisible Girl being the only FF member not to get her own Twinkies advert, she was always there but… altogether now – she was invisible.
As someone who talked about my deep love for the Sub-Mariner on a Find Your Joy episode of FW Presents, it was fun to hear you guys talk about the Hulk and Vision and Hostess ads.
Fun episode fellas. I had the Spider-Man handheld game. To be honest, I didn’t quite understand how to play it. I think I was just a little too young for it. Those “light-up blip” games never did anything for me. I much preferred the Spidey game I had on my Atari 2600!
Those of us who are Transformers fans (sorry, Rob!) have a special relationship with Marvel UK, as it provided Simon Furman (arguably the most influential writer of Transformers material beyond those who set up the origins of the concept) with his initial entry into the franchise. As with other Marvel UK books, their Transformers book was monthly (ultimately reaching issue #332, plus several annuals), and even though their comics had only roughly half as many pages as a US comic, that still meant that they went through stories roughly twice as quickly as US stories, necessitating the creation of “in-between” stories (written by Furman) designed to fit within narrative gaps between reprints of US stories.
IMHO, Furman did the best work of his TF career when he was forced to work in-between US writer Bob Budiansky’s stuff. Truly a treasure trove for now-adult US TF fans in the mid-90s and early-2000s (only a few years after the US comic was first cancelled) when first exposed to this whole other world of (mostly) in-continuity stuff still waiting to be read!
Great discussion about not Namor, fellas! More ads!
All I can say about Marie Severin’s art is wow! That splash page image of Namor is stunning! The Prince of Abs-lantis indeed.
Now you’ve blown my mind that the reprint comics were solely to print ads. That makes gobs of sense, obviously, but it crushes my little fanboy heart. Ow. But I wasn’t full-blown collecting yet and this time, so it’s not like I would have been buying them. But I did get the occasional example, like the Hulk reprint (Marvel Super-Heroes, maybe?), and the X-Men one (Amazing Adventures?) which was crazy for having only half of the original issue plus a backup taken from the “origins of the X-Men” that was a different issue’s backup. I’m not explaining it well, and it makes my head hurt to think about.
I truly wish the Marvel UK stuff would become available on the MU app. So many fascinating things for amateur or professional comic historians to dig into. I’d even love to see things from other countries, like the Spider-Man issues for spanish-speaking countries where Gwen Stacy survived! That’s real multiverse-level continuity!
The CBS Saturday Morning cartoons unintentionally reflected the overall image most people had of CBS in this era. They were the throwback network, playing it safe, going with what had worked before, not breaking new ground, overall the “safe” choice. Their executives seemed to take a very “corporate” approach to their programming. Only go with what already works. (All the networks are so “corporate” nowadays, it’s funny to call CBS out for it, but it was a different time.)
Let’s see, I turned 13 in 1980, so I’d watched lots of cartoons on TV during the 70s, and since my house didn’t get cable, so it was network and local stations. During weekdays, every local station played older cartoons before and after school, so I saw all kinds of older cartoons, many that likely were originally played in movie theaters. Bugs Bunny, Tom and Jerry, Popeye, Casper, Yogi Bear, etc. So knowing how CBS operated, I can easily believe they looked at the viewership of those local stations playing older cartoons and said, “If we make new cartoons with those characters, we’ll get all of those kids and sweep the competition!” But alas, they missed a key point. Us kids watched those cartoons because there was NOTHING else geared for us at those times of day except for PBS! Soap operas? Talk shows? Game shows? No thank you! But speaking for myself, I wanted new GOOD cartoons, not pale imitations of old classic cartoons. The classics were incredibly rewatchable. The newer stuff, not so much.
Oh and lest I forget, I remember rushing home every Sunday after church to watch reruns of The Cisco Kid and The Lone Ranger, plus the weekends had ample movies featuring Tarzan. So again, it’s no wonder they tried to extend that approach to those characters.
Wow, I’m filling up these Mountain Comics pages with more nonsense than I usually do. Thanks for putting up with me.