It’s the ninth nifty episode of WHO’S WHO REVIEW! Shag and Rob take a fresh look at classic entries from Who’s Who: The Definitive Directory of the DC Universe, featuring the Post-Crisis Superman, Professor Hugo Strange, the Manhunters, Gypsy, Tarantula, Brain Wave, Captain Fear, Balloon Buster, and more! Plus we cover YOUR feedback!
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Another fun and interesting show. I wasn’t sure you could do a review show for two hours but the time flew by before I knew it. This show was particularally memorable for me since it included the character who pulled me into the greater DC Universe.
I had seen DC comics before; Superman, probably some Batman, but it wasn’t until an older kid gave me his copy of Justice League of America #12 that I was hooked. Suddenly there was this whole universe of colorful and exciting characters, all courtesy of Dr. Light and Snapper Carr. Sorry, Rob, but you know what they say. You never forget your first love. So you can blame Dr. Light and Snapper.
To answer Shag’s question; originally the JLA did not know about Dr. Light. As he explained to Snapper, if he was going to become a master criminal, he would eventually have a run-in with one or more of the costumed heroes. So he figured his best bet was a pre-emptive strike before they knew of his existence.
His confrontation with Hawkman was a later retcon from an issue of Wanted, after they stopped the reprints and moved to new stories. It was later retconned again as, first an unnamed Thangarian Wingman, not Hawkman. And later erased from continuity entirely.
I believe it was originally planned to change his name to Photon to avoid confusion with the new Dr. Light, but that never happened.
There was actually a golden age Dr. Light. He had three appearances in All-American Comics in the Dr. Mid-Nite strip. The character first appeared in issue 82. Unfortunately, the way I understand it, because of the chaos behind the scenes at DC with National buying out All-American, the paperwork DC needed to file for the trademark rights was lost. He has been in legal limbo ever since. But he can be seen on the Comic Archives website.
I have been corresponding with Isamu and doing an entry on the pre Nelson Strong Adventurers’ Club. They actually go back all the way to 1940, but never had a dedicated series before Adventure Comics 426. That entry may, or may not, be in issue 4 of Xum’s Who. Isamu planned on giving you some information on the Adventurers’ Club. I hope I didn’t steal his thunder.
One interesting fact I came across in my research that Rob might find interesting. The story that appeared in Weird War Tales 28; The Isle of Lost Men, (or Soldiers, can’t remember the exact title right now), was originally written as a story for the Adventurers’ Club and scheduled for Adventure Comics 430. It was not in that issue and when the series got cancelled, Joe Orlando adapted it for Weird War.
That Weird War story, Isle of Forgotten Warriors, must have been heavily expanded, it fills the whole issue.
Are you sure Wanted featured that Dr Light retcon, Hal? There’s a Green Lantern reprint in here with Arthur, but I don’t think the book ever did new stuff.
Oh, sorted by Isamu below! Cheers, Nephew!
Fun show yet again, Uncle Rob and Uncle Shag. Some somewhat brief notes this time around…
BRAIN WAVE: The live action Brain Wave in the Superman 5Oth Anniversary Special was played by Robert Smigel, who did those TV Funhouse cartoon spoofs for Saturday Night Live.
DOCTOR LIGHT: He quit the villain game, quite literally, in BATMAN AND THE OUTSIDERS #5, which was the second part of a New Teen Titans crossover. He was captured and left tied up at Titans Tower while the Titans and Outsiders went off to stop the rest of the Fearsome Five, and when the heroes returned, they found Light’s empty costume with a large handwritten note that said, “I QUIT!”
The Hawkman retcon happened in DC SUPER STARS #14, with a story that had Katar Hol going to Earth before THE BRAVE AND THE BOLD #34. However, this didn’t quite fit with Hawkman’s history, even at the time of publication. Steve Englehart made a reference to that story in JLA #149 that suggested a different, unnamed Thanagarian lawman had pursued Dr. Light, and this WHO’S WHO entry followed suit.
Doctor Light is a unique JLA villain for essentially having his own version of “Zatanna’s Quest”, appearing in multiple comic titles throughout the Silver and Bronze ages as he fought individual Justice Leaguers.
The new Doctor Light was a originally supposed to be a Black woman, according to DC SAMPLER #2, which has a cameo illustration of her in The New Teen Titans preview drawn by George Pérez. According to an interview with Mr. Pérez in COMICS INTERVIEW #50, that plan changed because of the Captain Marvel character over at Marvel, who was originally a white male superhero and now became a black female superheroine — and whose power also had something to do with light and energy. So when they created the new Dr. Light in CRISIS, Mr. Pérez suggested she be Japanese instead.
I noticed the MALAGIGI entry did not include his Marital Status. Interesting…
I believe the other head in the surprint is that of Satyricus, a satyr who accompanied Arak on many of his adventures.
PODCAST TBD: I’m sure whatever Uncle Paul and Uncle Shawn are cooking up for their new podcast is going to make headlines…
MANHUNTERS: One of Kevin O’Neill’s memorable Tales of the Green Lantern Corps stories involved Grenda, a planet of living robots and homeworld of the robotic Green Lantern Stel. So it’s no surprise to me that O’Neill drew a WHO’S WHO entry of Green Lantern-like robots…
Also, the JLAers knew Mark Shaw was a Manhunter back in JLA #140. However, he adopted another villainous identity as one of the “Star Tsar”s that showed up in JLA #149 and #150 (the others being the Key and… *gasp* Snapper Carr?!). It was Shaw’s Star Tsar identity that was uncovered by the Red Tornado at the end of that tale.
Dad had actually done a dramatic recording for that non-existent MILLENNIUM podcast, by the way, which was going to be hosted by a real nice man who makes these podcasts about that obscure experimental Super character Uncle Shag talked about. I’ll have to find Dad’s notes on the YOUNG ALL-STARS crossover issues he was going to cover. All I remember is that those segments were going to include a music clip of Samantha Fox’s “I Promise You (I’ll Take You Away)”, and Dad would share some stories from his father and Uncle Kenzo about living in a Japanese internment camp during WW II.
ROVING RANGER: The Roving Ranger, like Arak, did not show up in the CRISIS series but did appear in the CRISIS crossover issues of ALL-STAR SQUADRON (#54 and #55).
I wish you had let me know you were planning to cover the XUM’S WHO entry for the ADVENTURERS’ CLUB. Ever since Volume II was released, I received lots of emailed information from “Hal” that I could have shared with you about numerous other appearances of “Adventurers’ Clubs” in Golden and Silver Age DC Comics stories, including ones starring Zatara, Congo Bill, Green Arrow, and the Martian Manhunter. There was even a “Lonely Adventuers Club” in MY GREATEST ADVENTURE #16. It’s enough to create a “Xum’s Who in the Adventurers’ Club” one shot special!
However, the multiple iterations of the club in DC Comics is really no surprise, given that there have been several Adventurers Clubs in the real world (not just around Disney parks). The earliest I found was founded in 1912, but there may be ones established earlier than that. There were also a number of “Explorers’ Clubs” in DC Comics stories for the same reason.
One fun fact Hal provided is that there was another Adventurers’ Club story planned for ADVENTURE COMICS that was retooled and expanded for use in WEIRD WAR TALES #28, titled “The Isle of Forgotten Warriors.” This was according to the Grand Comics Database.
Until the next review, gentlemen…
Whoops. I misremembered the reference to DC SUPER STARS #14 in JLA #149. Hawkman actually stated that he had pursued Dr. Light all those years before.
So it was likely Peter Sanderson’s research that pointed out that the DCSS story didn’t fit in Hawkman’s history, so the Who’s Who entry fixed it by making it an unnamed Thanagarian officer…
One brief follow-up to Isamu. There was also a DC version of the real world Liars Club. It first appeared in Flash Comics 44. Jay Garrick was granted membership when he told the outrageous story of secretly being the heroic Flash. They appeared sporadically in various Flash stories.
They also appeared in one Starman story when Ted Knight became a member after telling the outrageous story of how he was secretly the heroic Starman. Hmm, sounds familiar.
I bieve they may also have shown up in Superman.
In the third story of SUPERMAN #28, May-June 1944, plus a junior version in SUPERMAN FAMILY #199, February 1980…
1 i had the who’s who with captain fear and I dont remember Captain Compass at all.
2 the problem with the Detroit Leage is all these characters are better by themselves but togather? eh it’s “older hero leads rookies to wich young Rob said “WHY Would I want that When Batman and the outsiders does with Jim apparo art. Which did’nt stop me from pitching a steel and a Vixen story
3. i CAN see why you make Dr light a joke. He’s a bad guy he loses. Like Joker or Doom Lose but you think about his powers…HOWS he ever lose?
4. I think most of Identity crisis works at something VERY hard. A whodunit with Major superheroes Superheroes KNOW Whodunit Why it falls apart is becase of the thing Dr did that I wont disscus. he CANT BE the killer but people treat him like a suspect, Also during the murder the killer SPOKE and their voice would have been recorded
Oh, man, Rob – how could you forget the Capt. Fear episode of Who’s That?! It’s one of my favorites (after the Starfire episode).
I’m also a bit surprised that neither of you noted that Kevin O’Neill is also quite well known as the artist for League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.
And quit being mean to Heck; I think the art for the Mars entry looks perfectly fine…
That aside, I quite enjoyed the show as usual; personally, I really liked the art in the Malagigi, Night-Slayer and Hugo Strange entries, and agree that the Superman art, with Byrne inking Swan, is very nice. Byrne, in fact, is a pretty good inker when he wants to be; one of the most interesting inking jobs he did was on Steve Ditko’s pencils in Avengers Annual #13.
And finally, when Rob exclaimed ‘Who the Hell?’ it made me think that that would be a great name for another Who’s Who spin-off show. Either that, or rename the aforementioned Who’s That?
Evan Dorkin, Kyle Baker, Robbie Busch, and Stephen DeStephano released the Instant Piano anthology together through Dark Horse and won an Eisner for it, so suck it, Greenberger.
Hugo Strange spent decades being the missing piece of the Bat-Universe. After he was reintroduced to the post-crisis audience with the Prey story in Legends of the Dark Knight, we’ve been left waiting for a definitive modern Hugo Strange story in the comics (Arkham City eventually gave one in other media). And there was a long stretch of Batman events/line crossovers with mystery villains who could have been fairly revealed as Hugo Strange, but he still hasn’t really gotten his due. Instead, his strongest stories are still retelling of the old ones, the aforementioned Prey and also Matt Wagner’s Batman and the Monster Men mIni.
Also, I’m with Rob. Superman’s story is an immigrant story, making him technically American born loses that and gains nothing but the possibility of his being President, which is a dead end idea anyhow.
This episode was a great trip down memory lane. I fondly remember the Who’s That episodes on Balloon Buster and Captain Fear, because you both basically gushed about the entries and the characters. Such happy discussions, so it’s great to hear you guys talk them up again. Thank you, randomizer! (beep-beep-boop-bee-booooop!)
As Jeff R mentioned, Hugo Strange was in that LotDK story, which I feel retold many elements from that classic “Hugo wears Batman’s costume” story. Letting modern readers experience the craziness of Hugo all over again. I will say, I particularly enjoyed his inclusion in “The Batman” animated series. Excellently creepy.
Ok, bear with me. As part of my podcast re-reading Batman and the Outsiders comics from the 80s, I also read Batman and Detective Comics from those same months because, 1) I hadn’t read most of them before, 2) I wanted to check if there was any mention of the Outsiders in those issues [There wasn’t], and 3) it span the time when Jason Todd had red hair to black hair! And boy, SO MANY of those issues featured Nocturna and Night Thief/Night Slayer. They were definitely Doug Moench’s pet characters. The entries for both characters don’t do justice to how icky the relationships got, especially Nocturna’s fascintation with Batman AND Jason! Ew!!
So what’s my point? Oh, well the last appearance I noted for Night-Slayer was a couple of panels in Batman #400, that oversized anniversary issue where just about every Bat-villain appeared, and Moench’s grand finale from that era. Like lots of other villains, Nighty just wandered off muttering about Nocturna, rather than get pulled into another fight with Bats and Ra’s Al Ghul. That was basically it for the man in black in that era of Batman as far as I’ve read, and I started collecting Batman and Detective monthly right around this time. (Batman: Year One) Go figure.
When it comes to Byrne inking Swan, I remembered that he did it again later in Adventures of Superman Annual #2 from 1990. It featured a crossover with the L.E.G.I.O.N., and one of the chapters was penciled by Swan and inked by Byrne. This might get me in trouble, but it’s not my favorite chapter in that comic. It felt like “stunt casting” to get these two former creators for the comic, which I applaud in principle. But the results were lackluster, Swan’s character stiffness was too much of a contrast compared to the other chapters, and Byrne was in the middle of his “scratchy inking” phase which didn’t thrill me. As always, I freely admit that means “it’s not for me”, and smarter people can determine if it was “good”.
I’ll say it, I love Gypsy’s entry! Chuck Patton knocked it out of the park. I’ll leave it at that.
Can’t wait for more, you Who-vians! (heh-heh)
I was so excited when you guys promoted this episodes release! I actually woke up early on Sunday to listen. (Yes, I need to get a life).
The randomized (which I’m beginning to suspect doesn’t actually make that booping noise) brought us TWO former Who’s That? stars, Balloon Buster & Captain Fear! I really miss that show.
The Roving Ranger did indeed show up in All-Star Squadron 54 & 55, he even made the cover of 55. He was part of a group of time displaced heroes that included Silent Knight, Liberty Bell, Viking Prince and others. They team up with Firebrand to stop The Ultra Humanite from stealing a NASA Space Shuttle.
This was a great episode. It’s a lot of fun to listen to the two of you discuss the lower tier DC Characters.
Fun show as always gents. And you are both pretty. We enjoyed out time with both of you, and Kelley. Rob did bring me a really cool T-shirt and Cindy a tote bag she now uses every day though, just sayin’.
Balloon Buster: I think I brought up the inevitable casting of Vince Vaughn as Enemy Ace. Hey, he played Norman Bates and that worked out alright, yes?
Brain Wave: I’m glad Rob brought up the Superman 50th Anniversary TV special. I think the producers had this comic and this one alone to base the character design off of. It’s spot on to this entry. He was great on Stargirl though. Sincerely creepy!!!
Captain Fear: The girls on oHOTmu took the air out of the ballon on this one by pointing out how tiny his head is, and how big his clothes are. Maybe that height and weight IS correct!
Doctor Light: He was also on the Teen Titans animated series, around the same time Identity Crisis came out…which makes the whole thing even ickier. Yikes.
Gypsy: I didn’t like this character until her appearance in the Despero storyline in Justice League America, where J’onn showed up to protect his old friend She had a rather icky age-inappropriate romance with Bronze Tiger in Justice League Task Force. What was with late 80s/early 90s comic writers and these May/December romances with underage girls?
Malagigi: What a nice entry! Colon’s humor work (he co-created Richie Rich, Rob’s favorite) shines through here.
Manhunters: In one of the early issues of the Geof Johns/ Carlos Pacheco post-GL: Rebirth ongoing series, Hal is falling through the air with a compltely discharged power ring, and battling a Manhunter robot. He flips the face plate off the Manhunter and charges his ring from the internal Oan battery inside the robot, turns into GL and flies off. It was one of those cinematic, fist-pumping hero moments that stands out in my mind, and gets me excited about super hero comics. When I think of the Manhunters, I see that scene.
Mars: Once Rob said that about Diana auditioning for a Russ Meyer movie…HOLY COW!!! He’s right! Tura Satana IS Wonder Woman!
Night Slayer: Tim Price nailed it, Moench LOVED Night Slayer and Nocturna. And I got to where I loathed them. They just wouldn’t go away. There’s a protracted storyline where Night Slayer leaves Batman for dead, switches his costume, and starts running around as Batman doing bad things. Bruce then thinks he’s Night Slayer, and this goes on for what seems like a year (it was probably only a couple of issues, but I was 10). No one questions why Batman suddenly has a red beard. Of course Bruce comes back to himself and defeats him, but…yeah enough with these two. Gerry Conway balanced the soap opera well with the action in his prior Batman run. Moench got too sudsy for my tastes.
Professor Hugo Strange: Moench did a much better job on the aforementioned “Prey” storyline in Legends of the Dark Knight, featuring a much kinkier version of ol’ Hugo here. I think Denys Cown got the art gig because he just drew Batman Annual #10 featuring Strange, also written by Moench. The close up of Strange looks like the ghostly image Rogers drew in the classic ‘Tec run, and Rob’s right, the hitchiking ghost (another Disney World reference!) bit where he strangles Rupert Thorne is chilling!
Roving Ranger: I’m often not a fan of Mike DeCarlo’s very distinctive “chisled” inks, but I like this piece!
Superman: As much as I love Xum’s Earth-One Superman entry (and believe me, I do), in my childhoood mind, Swan should have drawn that, and Byrne should have done the post-Crisis version solo. But since he did indeed draw this one, the JLGL art makes sense (and in hindsight has become more iconic for the era). The figure is a bit too tiny, but a flying pose would have obscured some of his costume elements. And I believe that is a nother headshot of Clark in the Daily Planet group shot.
Tarantula: I’ve always loved this costume, and I can see the Dominic Forutne, but also a bit of Batman foe The Black Spider. Rob’s pitch was great! And it actually could have still worked with his later appearances in Nightwing.
The Adventurers Club: I know what Shag was talking about! I didn’t get to visit WDW during that period, but I am aware of the Adventuers Club. It ties into the subtle S.E.A. (Society of Exlporers and Adventurers) storyline running through many Disney attractions in the parks worldwide. There was supposed to be a Disney Plus series based on it, but I haven’t heard anything about it in a while.
(Making a note to strike the Night Slayer/Nocturna run from the list of upcoming episodes of Knightcast.)
Amazing episode as always. Just a couple of comments:
Captain Fear: Has no right to look this good. Simonson can do no wrong, even if the guy is wearing his dad’s suit.
Manhunters: Settle in.
a) I always thought the Manhunters represented Martial Law, soldiers wringing order to worlds regardless of methods. As such, why not have Marshall Law artist O’Neill draw them
b) I reviewed those JLA Manhunter issues on my site a while back. I had always thought that the ‘Manhunters were the original police force for the Oans’ was OLD History. Finding out that Englehart just created that whole cloth in the 70s floored me. So 1st issue Special is the first appearance of Mark Shaw and the cult, but the robot Manhunters first appearance is JLA 140.
c) I was waiting …. WAITING … for Event Leviathan to be brought up here since Shaw ended up the mastermind. WAITING !!!!! And then Shag goes ‘and remember the Manhunters were involved in a summer crossover …’ and I am driving and giddy thinking ‘here it is here it is here it is … Event Leviathan!’ and then Shag completes the sentence ‘Millenium’! What the absolute F!
Prof Hugo Strange – That scene of his ghost is in the Englehart run where he strangles Boss Thorne (as Chris said) but it is in the classic “Joker Fish” story and the last issue of the run of Englehart/Rogers. I wonder if they were wrapping stuff up. The ‘Prey’ arc in LOTDK by Moench/Gulacy is well worth it.
Roving Ranger – I thought this was an Isamu addition! I have zero recollection of this entry. ZERO !
Thanks again for great episode!
Dang it!! I had planned to crack a joke on the air about Mark Shaw and Event Leviathan, and then say “And now Dr Anj is going to write his dissertation… ”.
I can’t believe I forgot!!
First I little brag if May. My YouTube channel is now at thousand subscribers. My brother and I are very proud.
Brian wave looks one of keepers from the cage so he’s my number 1 this time .
Balloon buster number 2
And number 3 Captain fear
The Adventures club sounds interesting
But they need some woman members . .
And by the cage I mean the Star Trek episode some of those scenes where used in two part episode menagerie
You mean the one that has that obscure character (Christopher Pike) that Vulcan, Son of Fire was named after?
i REally enjoyeD this episode. the BrainwavE Entry really brought back some good memories from all star squadron and some early infinity inc issues.
Fantastic episode, as usual. Lots of thoughts, buckle up…
— Yes, Balloon Buster was retconned as Scalphunter’s son (and Trail Boss Matt Savage’s grandson) in Robinson’s Starman series, but only via a brief mention or two. It’s a shame Robinson never gave us a Balloon Buster flashback story; lots of untold stories from that very rich world he created via that series.
Meanwhile, his Base of Operations is “France, circa World War I” (likewise, Malagigi’s includes “in the 8th century A.D.”). It’s kind of funny how Who’s Who would deem a time period to be a “Base,” but guess I makes sense in a universe where it seems like anyone with a high-tech doohickey can time-travel.
— Brain Wave’s Group Affiliation fails to mention his stint with the Secret Society of Super-Villains, as part of that awesome Perez-drawn JLA story that made Rob crave a Rex Tyler Hourman solo series. And yes, Isamu, in the Superman TV special the ‘Wave was portrayed by Robert Smigel, who’s responsible for a lot of great comedy of the past 30 or so years—most notably (for me) Triumph the Insult Comic Dog. (“Brain Wave is a great would-be world conqueror…FOR ME TO POOP ON!”)
— While it is ridiculous that the JLA would have a minimally powered 15-year-old member, I find it more ridiculous that the member runs around barefoot. That said, I truly loved Justice League Detroit—it was the first ongoing story arc that I really cared about—and a recent reread was sufficiently engaging. The four new members all had contrasting personas and real character growth, culminating in what I still consider a shocking finale (didn’t Vibe and Steel stay dead for a long time?). Gypsy’s happy ending (she was reunited with her parents) was satisfying, nicely picked up years later when JL Task Force centered on her mentor-protege relationship with Martian Manhunter. I’m glad she’s persevered in the DCU.
— For what it’s worth, Wikipedia lists the Manhunters’ first appearance as that JLA story arc, not First Issue Special. I think the issue might be muddled by the fact that the robots’ costume is a carbon copy of the one worn by the original Manhunter, Paul Kirk, who was created by the same guy who wrote/drew that First Issue Special story (some long-forgotten hack named Jack Kirby). Also, Kevin O’Neil drew a few Who’s Who entries, most notably the awesome one for Bizarro.
— Let me add to the chorus saying Night-Slayer was cool, but he hung around the Batman titles for what seemed like eons. That said, he was fairly interesting—he came across as an honest-to-goodness, batshit obsessive lunatic, in a way that too many Bat-villains fail to do. (Seriously, a lot of the dudes in Arkham are such meticulous planners, they’re reasonably sane once you allow for the wacky costumes and penchant for murder.)
— Shagg, you asked where you’d seen the iconic image of Hugo Strange in the Batman costume sans the Bat-headpiece. It was the primary image for Hugo Strange’s loose-leaf Who’s Who entry, based on a scene in the then-recent Legends of the Dark Knight arc and likewise drawn by Paul Gulacy (an odd though beautiful choice for a Who’s Who image).
— I agree that the Superman entry suffers a bit from the tiny color image of the Man of Steel. But Rob, I don’t think a third page would be necessary; look at the Barry Allen Flash entry, which broke the text into separate pieces on different pages, allowing for a larger vertical image. Not sure why that approach wasn’t repeated for the other two-page A-listers.
And while on balance I’m happier with Kal-El being born on Krypton and not Earth, I always felt one advantage of the “birthing matrix” is that it could have explained why this refugee from a distant planet looks like a middle-American white dude. Byrne could have said something like, “The birthing matrix ensures that the fetus takes on the appearance of the dominant life form where it’s born.” (Of course, this would mean that all flashbacks to Krypton would feature weirdo-looking aliens rather than Brando, Crowe, et al.)
— I’m sorry, but despite my love for the Extraordinary Ordway, I think that Tarantula costume is hideous. Shagg, one of great things about his appearance in The Golden Age is that Paul Smith gives him a much more ’40s-appropriate costume (seen in only a couple panels, alas), though still inspired by the Ordway design.
— I understand why Rima and all other public-domain characters never got listings in the original series: It’s a slippery slope from the jungle lady in The Super Friends to freakin’ Santa Claus (who guest-starred in DC Comics Presents, after all).
— Finally, yes, Who’s Who was very inconsistent about whether the series aimed to represent DC’s publishing history or its standard superhero continuity. The letter columns always seemed to emphasize the whole history, but the bias toward super characters really undermined that. I’m going to reiterate a retroactive suggestion you guys read, and praised, on an episode years ago: The original series should have made room for half a dozen or so double-page entries, each spotlighting the various characters in one of DC’s genres of yesteryear (two pages featuring funny animals, two pages featuring teen humor characters, etc.). It would have done a lot to truly represent the company’s history, and been a far better use of space than some villain featured in two Green Arrow backup stories five years earlier.
Finally, I think you guys should consider having guests on future episodes of Who’s Who Review. You’d be making a bunch of us nerds very, very happy.
Noah, that is a brilliant idea, the birthing Matrix ‘programming’ newborn Kal to take on the appearance of the dominant lifeform… and maybe it did, after all, Byrne’s Kryptonians were a tad weird, all spoonfaced with minimal features, and flat bodied. To me they looked like playing card people from Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland.
As regards Steel and Vibe staying dead a long while after their JLA deaths, I don’t recall them ever being revived in that continuity.
So, we were asked to tell you how much we love the “boop-boops”….
Sorry, I just can’t do it. The “boop-boops” are dumb. I laugh, but it’s definitely AT you, not with you.
(So much for my ever getting invited back to one of your shows….) 🙁
Another wonderful episode! I am always excited for new episodes rom the F & W network. I love learning about such characters as Balloon Buster and Earth 2 Superman. Then to my horror, there’s evil Rob laughing at me and slandering my families good name! Thank goodness for Shag coming to my defense! My hero! He, among others like Chris and Cindy Franklin, Micheal Bailey and all the other great hosts (except that Rob guy) make this the best podcast network there is. Looking forward to all the great content. Keep up the great work and remember, #MortsAreReallyBadassesNoMatterWhatRobKellySays
Blame Wizard magazine!
Blame an out of business magazine? No sir! You perpetuate it! There was a time there were words used in every day society that are no longer used! Can’t we make that one of those words? That’s all I’m asking. But that’s ok if you can’t find it your heart of hearts to do this for me, Rob, I’ll understand. I’ll still call you evil Rob, but I’ll understand
Surely contributing to a comments echo chamber, but where Marshal Law is what I’ll always associate Kevin O’Neill with, the popular consensus would be League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. At this time, the only DC thing Kev had any clear association with was Green Lantern Corps, and his doing the Manhunters helps triangulate with Johns’ extensive exploitation of “Tygers.” I suspect Shag’s outsized opinion of the JLofA Manhunters/Star Tsar stuff comes from prolonged Millennium exposure, including the Secret Origins tie-in and the Ostrander/Rice Manhunter Mark Shaw series that followed it. DC sold all that stuff so hard, but not for long, given its weakly weekly nature.
That Don Heck run sure poisoned Wonder Woman perceptions. Sean Ross positively demonizes that period, like the Thomas/Colan stuff that preceded it wasn’t actually pretty good, or that we weren’t far removed by Conway/Delbo’s solid efforts. I’ll agree though that Mars was never a crowd or aesthetic pleaser in the way Perez’s Ares was. But also, Ares is boring as hell, so the upgrade was mostly cosmetic.
Balloon Buster: Where does the Owen Wilson casting come from? It sounds like the kind of dumbass thing the Hot Squad would come up with.
Mars: Reading some pantsuit Wonder Woman, I discovered they started calling Mars Ares in that era! Maybe it didn’t stick. (The story I read also had the first appearances of Deimos and Phobos, so an inspiration for George Pérez?)
Tarantula: It’s appropriate to say the Chaykinesque costume recalls Dominic Fortune, but even more so the Scorpion, which Chaykin created for Atlas Comics then PORTED OVER to Marvel with a name change. It is less appropriate to intimate that Tarantula might have been a Quality character, however. The truth is that Sandman was an All-American character, and Tarantula was at National.
More randomized boops please. Even if someone has to do it from outside through the window. You can call it the “boop window”. (Sorry, it’s a holiday weekend and I have extra time to really stretch out a bad joke)
The Tarantula redesign is one of my favorites. The original costume had that purple mask which left the sideburn area on the face uncovered and drives me crazy. How does it even stay on his head? I know the redesign foreshadows some of the worst costume choices of the 90s, and is not appropriate for the 40s (could brown even be reliably printed then?), but I still love it.
A couple of comments and a question concerning this fantastic episode:
I love the Superman entry w/ art from THE pre-Crisis Superman artist Curt Swan and the first post-Crisis Superman artist John Byrne.
It is sobering to see that the shrimpy, “physically unimposing” Brain Wave is the same height as me and has a similar build.
Part of why the DC Universe appeals to me so much is that it is kind of like a TARDIS. It’s bigger on the inside than it appears to be on the outside. To casual observers, it just seems to be only Superman, Batman, the Justice League, etc.. But take a good look inside and you find Balloon Buster, Captain Fear, Malagigi, the Roving Ranger, and the Adventurer’s Club.
The question concerns Doctor Light. He is one of the few villains who has a legacy character who is a hero in Kimiyo Hoshi. One of the others was also included in this episode, namely Brainwave whose son Brainwave Jr. became a member of Infinity Inc. The only other one that I can think of is Brainiac whose legacy eventually led to Brainiac 5 of the Legion. Any others? The Spoiler doesn’t count since that was a completely different identity from her father, Cluemaster.
How about the Harlequin II, Duele Dent, daughter of Two-Face, she was a good gal.
Good catch on the Duela Dent Harlequin.
Oh! Remembered another couple of points:
BlueSky has skeets, and that’s okay, because the euphemistic context for that word has been able to drink legally for a few years now. It originated from skeet shooting– throwing a target into the air that may end up getting blasted with a shotgun. See how that fits? Only dirty if you make it so. Anyway, the youth have somehow claimed “raw-dogging” to mean “engaging in a taxing activity without any mitigating comforts,” like flying on a plane without a book/movie/video game. If they can socially cleanse that, “skeets” should be like shooting clay pigeons. And is. LITERALLY.
I read the run of Atari Force for my side-project to Siskoid’s Who’s Editing. It’s fine. I read the mini-comics that came with Atari games way back in the day, but those were mostly by different Silver Age-indebted creators than the comic book series, which does a multi-decade time jump to mostly follow the children of the characters from the giveaways. The ongoing is by Gerry Conway and JLGLPBHN, and it’s a perfectly decent Star Wars knock-off in the vein of Micronauts or Dreadstar, but not as good as either. The art’s pretty, and some of the character designs are nice. The story reaches a couple of not-entirely-satisfying resolution points, but the launch creators were gone by then. I know that it’s dearly loved by some who were hit at the optimal age, and I honestly think Shag would enjoy the first year with the key creators. It’s very much his kind of book up to that point. But again, the rest of the run gets dumped on Mike Baron and Ed Barreto, who do a serviceable job of maintaining the tone and wrapping up the storylines. I suggest Shag skip to the first issue and give that a read, just to validate the money spent, but the series is ultimately overrated and inessential. It was basically post-Return of the Jedi methadone for when science fantasy dorks had limited options, especially in visual media. We’re well past that now. It’s a pleasant bathroom read that can be picked up and dropped at will mid-issue while pinching a loaf (which is probably what they call Mastadon tweets.)
Interesting, maybe I enjoyed Atari Force more than you, Frank, cos I never saw much Star Wars after the first one, so it all felt fresh… though I’ve heard George Lucas was heavily ‘inspired’ by Jack Kirby.
Love the randomizer. Play it between every entry! But make Rob do it. I find my joy in hearing his happiness fade each time he has to make the noise. (OK, not really, but I do enjoy the randomizer noises very much.)
Impressive podcast most impressive. Ah y’all should do the impact run. Those are awesome comics. Jaguar being my favorite and early. BWL run on a comic and Sheild was Mark Wade. Any way onto this current characters.
Balloon buster would be funny if Owen was him since his brother was Stripes on Star Girl. So he’d become his ancestor that could be interesting. Yeah a pilot who’s good at his job but bad at orders. Yeah so the outfit is Typical. Moving along.
Dr. brainwave Junior was a great hero too bad they turned him into his father. As for Brain wave. A very of his time villain. Like trump is now days but brain wave is less fat. And his head isn’t as big. Any way. Not a great costume. But, it’s fine. Glad the tv show updated him and Jr. star Girl was a fun show.
Captain Fear. Scicdo and his crew decimated him enough. Nothing but bones to pick of this Elton John styled Pirate. Sorry to Walt. But not his greatest design.
Next Doc light his replacement ware it better.
Best memory I have of him is when he was on the suicide squad, and Boomer hit the whole team with pies in the face. Next. Sorry he looks like he was in a child coloring book and he just got board coloring him and finish the face and we’re done with it through the crayons down and moved onto the hero of the book.
I like Gypsy so I’ll give her a pass. Invisibility is useful. Thus why she was in DCs Version of the FF. Her costume well it fits her name. I’ll leave it at that. And she was awesome pin Flash as Shagg pointed out.
Someone was playing way too much DND that is all I will say about this character. nexr
Ah the crappy version of manhunter. Books from my child . Shorts pin the outfit Oy. They’re not clark. Thus they look Like kids that put their underwear on outside of their pant by mistake. Only Supes looks cool like that. The rest Oy. And they stole Iron Man’s gloves. The boots did they steal them from George Clinton? If you’re not singing Atomic dog you shouldn’t ware boots like that. The helms makes them look like they’re working for powdered toast, man from Red and Stimpy.
Next
Mars yeah Perez did this guy a lot of favors cause he looks like a putz here. The shmuck. Any way. Sorry he looks like a reject from Renfer. Next .
Night Slyer is fine. Gene the Dean is a great Batman artist. Strange I always liked him. I first read about him in English class. Our teachers
Mrs. Jackson had comics I could read them in study hall. The ones where you Hugo strange replace Batman with the issues in the room they were good.next.
Roving ranger. Oy looks like someone’s uncle got really drunk at the barbecue and picked up his old six shooters. I’m looking to fight with whoever say him that IKEA furniture from Taiwan instead of making it here in America. Cause he says,” the peaces don’t fit right. And it isn’t made fur ‘marcan hands. I tell you what.” A half plaid shirt Oy. Captain tacky here.
Sorry
Next . Supes is a classic next.
I like tarantulas costume. It looks awe inspiring. Next.
The adventure club is a cool edition. Can’t wait for the next podcast.
Er sorry if the red neck Joke I made on roving Ranger went to far was just joking on some folks I know in life not dising IKEA furniture. Or Ranger cow Boys. And not meaning to.upset red neck much was just a bizarre joke in my head
Whatever Happened To?
Balloon Buster: Not only was it established that Matt Savage/Ke-Woh-No-Tay is his father, but Trail Boss Matt Savage is his grandfather. He has not been seen since Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight Annual #7 in 1997. I am quite shocked he wasn’t even mentioned in the New History of the DC Universe.
The Brain Wave: Henry King Sr. had cameos in volume 5 of Hawkman and is depicted in the first issue of the New History of the DC Universe.
Captain Fear: Fero was just seen in the New History of the DC Universe. His “successor” Cap’n Fear fought Batman in the late 90s. Further, there was a blink-and-you-miss-it cameo of Captain Fear in the Lego Justice League: Cosmic Clash animated movie.
Doctor Light: During New 52, it was established that Arthur Light was a small-time criminal who used tech to commit his crimes. He eventually gave it up and married Kimiyo Hoshi, the super-heroic Dr. Light, and they had 3 kids. After he retired, he was recruited as a scientist for A.R.G.U.S., where he accidentally gained the ability to drain energy. Amanda Waller offered him a deal: join her new team, the Justice League of America, and help her to take down the Justice League, or rot in a cell. He joined and tried his best to resist Waller, but during the beginning of the Trinity War, he involuntarily triggered Superman’s heat vision and was incinerated by it.
Post Rebirth, it seems his Earth-0 version and his New 52 version merged. He is now a being of pure energy. He was last seen leading a funeral for Deathstroke (that didn’t take).
Gypsy: New 52 changed Gypsy, too. Cynthia Mordeth was the daughter of the alternate-dimension despot Breacher, but she escaped to Earth 0 and was aided by Vibe (Cisco Ramone). Since Rebirth, it’s been established that Cynthia Reynolds is back, though she has yet to make any relevant appearance.
Malagigi: He has not been seen since Arak: Son of Thunder #50 in 1985.
Manhunters: Nothing has really changed about their history. They just showed up in Green Lantern #24 to fight Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner), Superboy (Kon-El), Silver Scarab (Dan Garrett), and Odyssey the Time Bandit. They were holding the Green Lantern AI Aya in containment to feed off her energy. She was happy to be reunited with her ship and to rebuild her body.
Mars: Concerned Zeus and his pantheon would be able to thwart his plans, Uxas (Darkseid) halved them, forming two distinct pantheons: The Olympian Gods and the Roman Gods. While his Greek counterpart has been active for decades, Mars and the rest of the Roman Gods have been quiet, preferring to work through agents (like Mercury with the Shazam! Family).
Night-Slayer/Night-Thief: The New 52 version of Anton Knight was last seen in the pages of Batwoman back in 2014, where he died. His costume was not nearly as cool.
Professor Hugo Strange: After working at Wayne Enterprises as part of The Doctors Three, Strange moved to Arkham Asylum. He also acted as an instructor at Gotham Academy. However in 2022, after a diagnosis of stage IV cancer, Hugo blew himself up in hopes of taking Batman with him. He did not.
The Roving Ranger: He has not been seen in any form since his appearance in All-Star Squadron in 1986.
Superman: Kal-El is married to Lois Lane, with their (artificially aged) son, Jon, also going by the name Superman. On top of that, there is Kong Kenan, the Super-Man from China. Plus, there is his cousin, Kara, acting as Supergirl, and her Earth-Two doppelganger, Power Girl (now using the alias Paige Stetler). And there are his two adoptive children, Starchild (Otho-Ra) and Red Son (Osul-Ra), who were rescued from slavery on Warworld. And there is Superboy (Kon-El), Mon-El (Lar Gand still in the Phantom Zone), the two Steels (John Henry Irons and Natasha Irons), Superwoman (Lana Lang-Irons), and Strange Visitor (Sharon Vance). And don’t forget the pets: Krypto, Streaky, and Beppo.
Superman has just discovered a new power: he can shield himself from Kryptonite for 2 minutes, but after that he is completely powerless for a length of time. He needs this: a city-sized meteor of Kryptonite recently landed on Earth, leading to huge advances in technology, and a proliferation of criminals who have access to the stuff.
It has also been just revealed that Clark Kent did publicly debut as Superboy on his 15th birthday. How he and his parents were able to navigate a world that they weren’t ready for (and a world that wasn’t ready for a Superboy) will be explored in Action Comics.
Tarantula: John Law’s debut as Tarantula has been confirmed in the New History of the DC Universe. Sadly, John Law died when Blockbuster burned down the building he (and Dick Grayson) lived in. His successor, Catalina Flores, isn’t the champion of virtue he was. She has been on both sides of the law: she’s helped Green Arrow and run afoul of Batman and Nightwing. She sacrificed herself at one point but was resurrected by the time manipulations of Dr. Manhattan.
Nelson Strong & the Adventurers’ Club: Nelson Strong was last seen in the pages of Swamp Thing v2 when he was hired by the Clinton Administration to hunt down and stop Swamp Thing. He died in a pitched battle against Swamp Thing in the streets of Amsterdam. Among his trophies were heads and taxidermied bodies of various creatures from throughout the DCU, including a Manhawk, a Gorilla from Gorilla City, a Chemo body, a Shaggy Man body, the head of Abnegazar from the Demons Three, a head of Ultivac, a G.I. Robot head, a Medusa, a Patchwork Man, and a Werewolf.
Amazing info, Jeff. About five minutes after you posted this, the Manhunters showed up in Green Lantern #24, as dull as ever.
Hey Rob –
I checked all my font sources – my personal library, daFont.com, What da Font, Adobe Fonts, etc. – and I wasn’t able to come up with a good match for the Manhunters logo. This was clearly a hand-crafted font from back in the day when designers and artists still had the luxury of time to do this sort of work. It would be awesome to expand this into a full font set, but creating typography is not my forte.
It’s a beautiful logo (though the kerning difference between the “MA” and the “NH” drives me batty).
Whilst I’m not calling your randomiser into question, but it’s strange that you “just” happen to include a character from both issue #58 of All-Star Comics. Of course, as well as giving us the Brainwave redesign (andyes the eyes are an odd choice), and making Roy happy again, it also gives us the triumphant return of the Star-Spangled Kid. Oh, and also some new character, though I’m sure no one would be interested in here…
So lovely to have another show from Rob and Shag.
The heck with ‘boo boo boo be booo boo’ deciding what gets discussed on the show, if characters have been down to death – I’m looking at you Captain Fear and Balloon Buster with your original Who’s Who show and your Who’s That? specials – throw them back into Brenda Pope’s hat and give us someone fresher.
Didn’t Doctor Light I get the makeover as a Justice League hero in New 52 – that was a rubbish idea, nobody child possibly accept Arthur Light as starting out as a good guy given the existence of Identity Crisis.
Wasn’t Kevin O’Neill banned by the Comics Code after his green GL Corp strips? What are those digests Shag, Commando Books? I’ll give you a bunch when you visit… you are planning to visit, aren’t you?
Shag, as a buyer of JLA during the Steve Englehart run I can safely say the Manhunter stuff was the most boring thing ever it just went on and on. Privateeer looked ridiculous – it seemed that at some point he was planning to put Privateer on the team (a la Swordsman in Avengers, heck, he even gave us a DC Mantis) but even he lost interest.
Rob is right, the post-Crisis ‘Superman was born on Earth’ bit was a terrible idea. He can have our world as his home, but not having had his ickle feet so much as touch Kryptonian soil is awful.
Rob, Pluggy McPlugface has to be a reference to Boaty McBoatface – did you hear about that in the US? Just in case anyone hasn’t, from Wiki!
‘The story of “Boaty McBoatface” began with a public poll run by the Natural Environment Research Council (NERC) to name their new polar research ship.The name “Boaty McBoatface” became a viral sensation and received the most votes, far surpassing other suggestions. However, NERC ultimately decided to name the ship after Sir David Attenborough, a renowned naturalist and broadcaster, as a more fitting tribute to his contributions to science. As a compromise, they decided to name one of the ship’s submersibles “Boaty McBoatface”.’
Love love LOVE The Randomiser noise, it’s up there with SHAZAM! and The Whip.
I just watched an episode of Batman: Caped Crusader (A must watch for any BTAS fan) where Anton and Natalia Knight are the villains du jour. Anton is a “Doctor” in a carnival sideshow and his sister Natalia is his plant in the audience.
Also, appearances by Julie Madison, Leslie Thompkins, Waylon Jones, and orphans Dicky, Jace, Steph, and Carrie.
Balloon Buster: Cool character, really should be used more. “Enlisting … at the onset of World War I” *scoffs* WWI had been going on for years before the U.S. got involved. It’d been better if he had of been one of the Americans who joined the French Air Force, like in real life.
Brainwave (Sr.) – It was cool that he sacrificed himself to save his son. A type of redemption not often seen in villains.
Captain Fear – Didn’t know about him before the Who’s Who entry. Cool art by Simonson.
Dr. Light – When he fought the Teen Titans in TT #44, he was treated as a legitimate threat. The perception that he was loser started in New Teen Titans and was carried over to Suicide Squad and Identity Crisis, with his threat level varying up and down in that period.
Gypsy – A silly character when introduced, but later writers made her a better character.
Malagigi – An interesting character who served his supporting character role in Arak.
Manhunters – They have a special place in my heart due to me picking up back issues of Millennium and it’s crossovers back when I started collecting comics. O’Neil also did the entry for the Spider Guild, which was connected to both the GLC and the Omega Men (which he did back-up stories for with Alan Moore).
Mars – Nothing really to say about him. Perez did more to make him Wonder Woman’s primary foe. Like many of Earth 1 WW’s foes that had entries, only in issues from the previous few years.
Night-Slayer – Didn’t know about him before I got the issue with this entry. Haven’t read many books with him in them since them.
Professor Hugo Strange – Didn’t remember Denys Cowen doing this art. Not mentioned was his Earth 2 counterpart, who died in one of the later issues of Brave and the Bold.
Roving Ranger – They gave him an entry, but left out Sonik? *scoffs*
Superman post Crisis – Nice passing of the torch art between Swan and Byrne. I agree that there should have been a formatting change to make the main Superman image large. And I prefer to Kryptonian-raised-as-a-human origin to the full Kryptonian, “Clark Kent is Superman’s critique on the whole human race” version.
Tarantula – I like his costume, although I agree it looks more like something designed in the 80s instead of something that was supposed to have been designed in the early 40s.
I recent got a copy of Xum’s Who 2. Yay.
You guys should check out The New History of the DC Universe. It feels like it is made for fans of the original Who’s Who. It goes chronologicaly through DC’ s history, spotlighting all the characters from the different eras. It includes some characters from more recent storylines, but most of them are classic characters from DC’s publishing history as seen in Who’s Who.
Plus the outstanding art is by Todd Nauck and Jerry “The Extraordinary” Ordway!
“I’m the gun…I’M RGE GUN…” Does Megatron know about this?