JSA in the 90s – Spotlight on The World at War RPG Sourcebook by Mayfair Games (1991)

In honor of Veteran’s Day, we dive into one of the most beloved RPG sourcebooks of the era, THE WORLD AT WAR! Published in 1991 by Mayfair Games for the DC HEROES ROLE-PLAYING GAME, this exceptional volume spotlights the legendary World War II era of the DC Universe.

Highlighting the WWII homefront heroes like the Justice Society of America, All-Star Squadron, Young All-Stars, Freedom Fighters & more! Plus, the battlefield heroes and settings like Sgt Rock, Blackhawks, Unknown Soldier, Dinosaur Island & more! And finally some heroes lost in the CRISIS, such as the Golden Age Superman, Batman & Robin, and Wonder Woman!

Join Siskoid and The Irredeemable Shag as they celebrate one of their all-time favorite RPG supplements! This episode is a crossover between the JSA IN THE 90s PODCAST and the HERO POINTS PODCAST! Therefore, this same episode is being released on both the JSA PRESENTS feed and the LET’S ROLL PODCAST feed.

 

 

 

 

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29 responses to “JSA in the 90s – Spotlight on The World at War RPG Sourcebook by Mayfair Games (1991)”

  1. Hey guys. Good show. I was able to follow along with my copy. Here are a few thoughts I had as you went along.
    Yes, Shag. The Japanese artifact used to create the Barriar was the Holy Grail. Roy Thomas name dropped Prof. Jones in an early issue of As-SQ, but I guess on Earth Two, Indiana Jones never managed to retrieve the Grail.
    Thomas originally wanted to use the Quality heroine Wildfire for the All-Stars, but DC vetoed that. Editorial was worried readers would become confused because there was already a Wildfire in the Legion. That’s how Firebrand came about.
    I don’t know if Thomas was aware of the Spicy/Culture pulp imprint that Harry Donnenfeld, the publisher of DC for most of the Golden and early Silver age, also published until 1950. They had several characters who could quite easily be analogues for the erased characters.
    Jim Anthony the Super detective, who was a Superman anologue, Olga, the girl with X-Ray Eyes, who could quite easily substitute for Wonder Woman; and Nick Turner, Hollywood Detective for Batman.. If their age was a problem, because they were all older in the pulps, Thomas could have easily deaged them as a result of the Crisis.
    In the original History of the DC Universe, supervillains began appearing about the same time as the heroes. I guess as part of that “moral balance” you talked about. That idea was also used by Waid in the New History.

    Winston Churchill should have been the one to write the commentary on the Blackhawks since they were originally based in England and worked closely with the British in the early days of the war.
    The White Lions were led by a man called “Death” Mayhew and were a group of Axis pilots who were suppossed to be a match for the Blackhawks. I don’t think they had more than a couple of appearances.
    The reason you can’t find a listing for Flower in Easy Company is because he didn’t exist. Marv Wolfman screwed up the name. It should have been Farmer Boy who was killed in Crisis.
    There were at least two missing war concepts from the war heroes. The demolition team of Big Al, Little Al and Charlie Cigar, known as the TNT Trio. And war correspondent Wayne Clifford, who appeared in the Dateline: Frontline series. Also left out was a group called Das Primate Patrol. They only appeared in one issue of Weird War before 1991 but come on, who doesn’t love Nazi gorillas?
    Until next time, keep em flying.

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  2. Great show guys! I never got to use my original Mayfair DC Box Set much (never got an actual game/campaign off the ground), but I did love the Sourcebooks. I had no idea this one existed until you brought it up a while back. I will now be on the lookout for a copy. Love the cover, and glad they didn’t go with that Hitler one.

    The book sounds legitmately fun and seems like a great reference for the characters, which is what I come for. Glad to see the orignal Earth-2 Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman and of course my beloved Earth-Two Robin weren’t forgotten!

    Chris

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  3. Love the show! I never got into DC Heroes RPG, although it was definitely around at the time I first started gaming in 1988. My first exposure was to Hero System, and I couldn’t find a store near Northeast Missouri State University (now Truman State U) in Kirksville, MO that had a solid gaming section.

    This episode reminded me of the time I created a group called the Sentinels of Liberty (Miss Liberty, Blue Comet, Captain Power, Lionheart, Shadow Stalker, and Golden Shield) for a Champions (Hero System) game in a gaming mini-con in graduate school around 1991-92. I later played them as NPCs in the regular Champions campaign I was running at the time when my players traveled back in time. Their enemies were the Axis Powers (Jotunheim, Tokyo Rose, Vergeltungswaffe, Luftwaffe, Axis Sally, Nachtjaeger, Nucleus, and Dragon Lotus).

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  4. I think if I played this with pre made characters here’s who I would be .
    1 Johnny thunder . (Some body has to be the comedy guy .)
    2. Hour man

    3. Wild cat

    If i played a solider
    1. The gosht tank
    2. Patches from the creature commandos( Frankenstein is my favorite I’m not gonna pass up a chance to play as ww2 version).
    3. G. I robot the original version so I’d have to be his human operator as well
    . Here’s a secret question.:
    Who if the Fire and Water network did an another big rpg show this time set in WW2 in the west Africa who would you play as . And who would want on your squad against the desert tiger?

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  5. Hello,

    I just wanted to post a correction. You mentioned there wasn’t a replacement for Golden Age Aquaman in the Young All-Stars similar to Arn Munro, Fury, and Flying Fox. There was one and I believe it was Neptune Perkins. If I remember right he was meant to take over for Aquaman. Though I do not think it was mentioned as much. With that said are we to assume that any story that featured Golden Age Superman for example, still happened Post-Crisis but it happened with Arn Munro instead and so on and so forth? That is a question I have always had. Also Fury originally was Diana’s and Steve’s daughter on Earth-2 but then wasn’t post Crisis, and got a new origin etc.

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    1. I thought I did mention Neptune Perkins. I think what Shag was saying was that there WASN’T an Earth-2 Aquaman which is an old joke between him and Rob Kelly on their shows together. I think there is (I KNOW there is, he’s even in two issues of All-Star Squadron), but I didn’t want to indulge him.

      To answer your other question: Just what happened in the 40s without Supes, Bats etc. varies according to the story. Roy Thomas did an issue of A-SS for example where the Squadron fight Funny Face instead of Superman (it was a Superman solo story). So sometimes it’s the Young All-Stars, sometimes it’s someone else, sometimes they never happened at all.

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      1. Hello,

        Thanks for the reply 🙂 I appreciate it. I think it was Shag who said there wasn’t a counterpart to Golden Age Aquaman because there wasn’t a Golden Age Aquaman. Golden Age Aquaman tended to have yellow gloves if I am remember correctly. I could be wrong though. Also totally different origin as well. I think DC is going to eventually work in a new golden age Aquaman at some point if I remember something from their “New Golden Age” one shot.

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        2. I swear, this is a very old joke between Rob and Shag, and I can’t believe we’ve been dragged into it despite ourselves. There’s even an episode of Fire and Water that’s just about the yellow gloves, if I’m not mistaken.

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  6. I am half a sleep when I am commenting, waiting for dogs to come in and listening to podcast. Anyways I didn’t finish my thought in the last comment. My next thought was about Fury, If she is now the Wonder Woman substitute, up until it is established later that Diana’s mother went back in time to be Golden Age Wonder Woman was the assumption for her to do all the stuff Golden Age Wonder Woman did? Was this ever fully explained in the Wonder Woman books where Hippolyta goes back in time and becomes Wonder Woman? Anyways I am going to sleep sorry for double comments.

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  7. When Shag and I discussed Liberty Belle in the context of issue #7 of the 90s JSA comic, it was in the context of our extended discussion of her daughter, Jesse Chambers. At the time, my only knowledge of Libby Lawrence came from more modern comics such as All-Star Squadron. In fact, I had wrongly assumed that Libby was from one of the companies that DC bought out in later decades, until Diabolu Frank (while we were recording for his DC Secret Files podcast) informed me that she was, in fact, a DC creation from her beginnings, and I have since been able to track down and read perhaps a dozen or so of her Golden Age appearances (sadly, they’re not on DC Universe Infinite).

    What surprised me about reading those stories (and why I bring it up in this context) is how *little* the ringing of the actual Liberty Bell (which was said to give her a boost of adrenaline to explain her superheroic feats) actually featured in those stories (and, Shag, the guy who rang the bell was Tom Revere, a guard at the Liberty Bell said to be a descendent of Paul Revere). Most of the time, Libby simply happened to be on the scene when the Nazis were up to no good, changed into her Liberty Belle costume, and set to work stopping them (I think I may have seen her stop by a phone to ring Tom *once* in the stories I caught, but don’t quote me). Obviously, writers even before Roy Thomas (who infamously killed Tom off in All-Star Squadron, at a point in the War before the Golden Age Liberty Belle stories had even started being published!) found the limitation of ringing the actual Liberty Bell difficult to work around, and found it easier just to either ignore or handwave it.

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  9. Sounds like a super-fun book! I love things like this.

    White Lions were the Blackhawk-inspired Nazi flight team in Chaykin’s mini-series. Would love to see those pages, especially if Chaykin did the head shots!

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  10. Truly fun episode, guys. WWII in the DC Universe is a high point for comics. I would love a new volume All-Star Squadron by Mark Waid and Chris Samnee.

    I especially loved the conceit that the sourcebook is narrated by characters. It added a fun element to the information.

    Great job!

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  11. 1 Clever what they did with Batman same stats way fewer skills
    2. that’s a pretty grim robotman if it’s really the 1940s
    3 That it! im pitching blackhawk

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    1. Definitely the angsty Robotman from all-Star Squadron, and not so much the comedy Robotman of the actual Golden Age strips (see also his rocketpack which was A-SS only).

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  13. All pictures of Sergeant Rock and Easy Company in Mayfair materials are from page 1 of Sgt Rock #380, but Farmer boy was long dead by then, and was statted with Canary’s head.
    August of 1944, the “still alive as of” date was also when “Tag-Along” went with Easy… until a quake of his own creation reminded him that he was the Silver Age Superman (i.e. STR 50, Flight 45). That one German pilot commented that his plane was freezing in August.
    Adolf was also statted in FASERIP, GURPS, and M&M 2E.
    Rock and Stuart teamed up several times in comics.
    Back in the Who’s Who podcast, Shagg & Rob pondered how to pronounce Johnny Quick’s speed formula. Here, the German government answered: “three-ex-two-nine-why-zee-foray.” They also mentioned experimenting extensively with it… Just hope they didn’t try too many bullet races. Also, it appears Johnny deduced how to summon the Thunderbolt between Flash Comics #19 & 20, July & August 1941.

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  15. I loved this discussion, and I love that there was so much real history. I think I might have to pick up one of those rare copies. Random thoughts:

    1. They should’ve included stats for Stalin and Churchill.
    2. The stats for Wonder Woman from All-Star #23 should match her post-Crisis stats from her JLE appearances, since she was in the one about as much as the other.
    3. A “Heroes on the Homefront” campaign would be a problem for me, I think. After 9-11, it was more than a year and a half before I could deploy to support combat ops directly. So, I know from similar experience that not directly fighting the main body of the Axis while many other people were doing so would drive me to distraction. But maybe we could use that in the game.

    Looking forward to the next podcast team-up!

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  16. Its too bad Mayfair lost the license and never did a supplement featuring the forgotten or missed characters like Kid Eternity, Gay/Grim Ghost or Hop Harrigan. Or the Squadron of Justice after DC got the full rights to the Fawcett characters in 1992.

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  17. The week the JSofA #10 episode was announced, I thought about trying to catch-up on #9. For whatever reason, when I remembered that it was a Guy Gardner guest appearance, I gave up. I’m a fan of that anti-hero, but knew this was going to be a labored slugfest wheel-spinner ahead of the finale, plus poor representation for Guy. After the #10 show dropped, I had other concerns to address, plus I knew that I’d be the one sour note at the wake. So, how about some comics comment in the midst of this half-Hero Points compromised edition?

    While still a bit overly feathered, Mike Machlan had found his way to inking Mike Parobeck by #9. The JSA still look great, but Guy Gardner just doesn’t look right in their company. Part of it is the ugly short-lived solo series suit (why would a Bostonian weak cowboy boots?) and part of it is Parobeck aping Joe Staton, giving his a “Who Framed Roger Rabbit” quality. Mostly though, it’s the simple fact that set against the dignified elder statesmen, Guy feels more like a Ultragen thug than a misled contemporary. It bugs me that on a team made up mostly of non-powered detectives that it took them so long to figure out that they were getting G. Gordon Godfreyed. Then again, the JSA let HUAC take them out of commission for (at this point) over thirty years (assuming the Post-Crisis/Pre-Zero Hour DCU “Modern Age” of heroes started in the early ’80s.) They’re not the strongest heroes in a number of ways, especially when written by Len Strazewski. I don’t get the impression that McNider’s clinic is the most successful or in a prime Gotham location, but it’s still weird for Louisa Soliz to be sleeping there. Feels like a Nick Riviera area. Alan Scott getting taken out by a wooden bench with visible metal rails/legs? Gah– these guys seem to need Dr. Fate and the Spectre to do anything but fight plain ol’ people.

    Hey look– JSofA #10 has the cover that #1 should have had! They almost look competent when the few members with ranged powers are not impotently blasting Giganto on an homage to another company’s (slightly) more popular elder team like that one guy with a pistol in Arsenio Hall’s gang from Harlem Nights (https://youtu.be/nNXxlYCU0aY?si=5nw7ETWFrwIRCh5H&t=46). When we covered Starman on DC Secret Files, it was pointed out that he was kind of a Superman type who served that role during his Golden Age JSA run, and it proves true here as well. The series chose to focus on beloved but under-powered also-rans in their 60s with the fighting stamina of Dorothy McHugh, and guest turns by Hourman and Starman was their LifeCall. Ted Knight just shows up and cleans up the mess of this series. No wonder DC was like “let’s just do another Staman book after this.” And then there’s the lick. Yeah, we can all pretend it was just to mess with the heroes’ heads, but we all know it was probably an off-panel Sleez/Purple Man thing that we hope Shiera doesn’t remember. There’s also a charged subtext to Thunderbolt’s being impaled by Dime-store Despero that we will all agree to forget. Second issue in a row with an unearned double page spread, just to fill space. But the best part is the final page splash of the team that we wanted for this series, but only got in the final issue.

    I prefer the unused cover of The World at War, mostly because it offers Baron Blitzkrieg with a more prominent Robotman/All-Star Squadron. The actual cover very cleverly incorporates the super-heroes into a more overly WWII supplement, but it so favors a Kubertesque Sgt. Rock that the super-hero aspect is too minimized. If I didn’t already own this edition, I’d have overlooked that in other people’s comic shops. However, when I had my own comic shop, and probably even in the brief period when I had a Mayfair gaming group based there, one of our gaming distributors (Chessex?) offered a liquidation lot of related materials. I know that I priced and displayed them, but I’m not sure that I sold any, and when we closed down, I kept what was left for myself. There isn’t a price sticker, and I used to hoard reference materials when I still held out hope that I might someday write for DC Comics. I didn’t need stats for human G.I.s, but I don’t remember a lot of the wartime super-heroes turning up in the Who’s Who looseleaf editions, and probably caught the All-Star Squadron types when giving this a toss.

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  18. I’ve never been a role-playing game guy, so half of what you guys were talking about I didn’t understand. But I still really enjoyed the conversation. And you’re right, you never wanna go full Hitler on the cover! Great job, Siskoid and Shag.

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  19. I bought this book on Siskoid and Shag’s recommendation in the early days of the Hero Points podcast (along with 2nd edition DC Heroes and the Atlas of the DC Universe) and love it. So many Golden Age characters!

    I’ve been running a DC Heroes game on and off since 2020, with player characters as members of the Secret Society of Super Villains (1970s version, but with original characters).

    One eight week instalment had them flung back to Earth-2 of the post-war 1940s, desperately trying to find a way home. Along the way, they met the Injustice Society, aliens, the Viking Commando, the Creature Commandos and travelled to Dinosaur Island with Wildcat, Black Canary and Johnny Cloud. We got a ton of stories out of that book.

    Thanks Shag and Siskoid for pointing me and my gaming group to a game that has given us hours and hours of fun.

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