On this episode of Peace Bound and Down: A Wonder Woman Podcast, Sean is joined by Fire and Water all-star Ryan Daly to discuss issue 5 of volume two of Wonder Woman. Join them as they talk about Wonder Woman’s battle with Phobos and Deimos, which culminates in a face-off with Ares!
This podcast is a proud member of the FIRE AND WATER PODCAST NETWORK:
- Fire & Water website: https://fireandwaterpodcast.com
- Fire & Water Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/FWPodcastNetwork
- Fire & Water on Twitter/X: https://x.com/FWPodcasts
- Fire & Water on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/fwpodcasts.bsky.social
- Fire & Water Podcast Network on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/fwpodcasts
- Promos:
- CheersCast
- JSApril Event
Bringing a little to man’s world each month.
Podcast: Play in new window | Download
Another great episode, withba really action packed plot! I do think rules for gods and monsters and killing are different, especially since they almost always come back!
I am a bit curious about your opinions on the Brian Azzarello run of Wonder Woman in the n52 – often controversial, but given the enjoyment of Tom King’s run (which I also am mostly enjoying), I know the brave and bold hosts do not shy from such comic book conflagrations.
Lastly, forgive me if you have already mentioned, but how do you read the Perez run to prep for the podcast? Single issue, digital, omnibus, trade?
Forgot to mention that while Diana does have some golem elements in her clay origin, I think Pygmalion has more resonance to me, personally!
Oh come on Diana, Etta is NOT wide enough to be two of you. You should be celebrating her bravery and resilience, not looking her up and down and judging her. And that is what you’re doing, youth is no excuse. Unlike you, Etta wasn’t created perfect.
Talking of bravery, well done to the mortals for showing up (most of) the gods, sailing away in fear rather than joining forces agains Arse.
Also, soldierman Matthew Michaelis – HOT!
Anyway, always fab to hear Ryan on a show – I think it was probably me who moaned about Diana being called a golem; I’m with Ian, she was created to be loved, not feared, so that’s Eliza Doolittle.
I have perhaps one cup of coffee a day, but only instant – I’ve never understood spending huge amounts of money for coffee that someone else has made.
Sorry Ian, I didn’t mean this to be a direct reply to you, I’m berating that uppity Wonder Woman!
Martin,
Thanks for listening and writing in! I agree that paying a lot of money for coffee is silly (though I wouldn’t pay any money for coffee obviously).
Diana’s comment about Etta isn’t kind, but it is revealing about the sheltered nature of her upbringing. I am reading along with the show, so I might be wrong, but I don’t think that Etta gets a real chance to shine on her own in this run. There’s no Etta like the original Etta.
Ian,
Thanks for listening and writing in!
I am not usually a fan of Azarello’s writing, but Cliff Chiang’s art is so good that it pulled me in. I like the depiction of the gods in that book. However, while I understand the choice to make Zeus Diana’s father, I wasn’t a fan. The symbolism of Diana as formed by the combination of the gods blessings and her mother’s love is just too good to lose.
And to prep for the podcast, I am rereading the run in single issues. I can’t resist the newsprint and ads for other comics.
aww, the chocolate and peanut butter of podcasters! I love Ryan on any show! When are we getting the full Secret Origins of Sean and Ryan?
Ryan and I are planning a show where we finally reveal our secret origins. Ryan is the secret love child of Roy Thomas and Ann Margaret, who Roy actually created. My parentage is equally strange, as my father is Jim Shooter and my mother is Jim’s ego, which gained sentience back in the 70s.
The name you were looking for, Sean, is Naglfar (pronounced Nah-gil-far). It’s a ship made up of the nails of the dead, which is why keeping your nails well trimmed is part of the Norse way of life. Best to give Hel the least amount of building materials possible. 🙂
Gene! Naglfar is a surprisingly subdued name for Norse mythology. If I can pronounce it and not sound like I’m Paul Reubens dying in Buffy tye Vampire slayer.
Another wondrous episode, Sean. And Ryan, I’ve gone back and listened to all of your Secret Origins podcasts. Despite being a huge Roy Thomas apologist, I found them quite interesting and usually entertaining. Hopefully, we can agree to disagree about Tom King. I really enjoyed his Vision mini-series, Danger Street, and the Batman/Elmer Fudd one-shot. On the other hand, Heroes in Crisis, Batman/Catwoman, and Supergirl: Woman of Tomorrow minis were painful to get through. My rule of thumb: If he writes a character I know and love, I don’t buy the book. If it’s someone I’m less familiar with, I may give it a shot. And my wife probably dislikes his work more than I do. She actually cringes when she hears his name. So we have not tried his Wonder Woman …
My favorite Greek mythical moment? I always love the story where Aphrodite has many suitors and Hephaestus makes his case by saying, “I’d make a good husband for you. I work late.” Of course, the punishment of Prometheus is a contender in terms of “ick factor”. And a recent Loki mini-series at Marvel made great use of Naglfar (thanks Gene Hendricks!).
On to this particular issue of WW–The cover for this issue is the cover of my TPB edition of Vol. 1 so DC must have really liked it. Deimos does have a much more interesting visual than Phobos, even if some of the panels make it look as if his nose hairs are snakes too. Ares is also a fantastic visual–mysterious and intimidating.
And my wife and I were both struck by that panel where Diana talks about Etta’s weight. I know that the only frame of reference Diana had at that point was Amazonian physiognomy, but Perez doesn’t draw Etta as all that large.
And just for the record, I don’t have any strong feelings about aging Steve Trevor for this series, but my wife does not like it at all. Keep up the good work. The Wonder Wife and I appreciate it.
Super Captain! Thank you so much for listening and for always sending in such thought provoking and fun commentary.
I totally get why some folks don’t like Tom King’s work. It leans to the morose, which, sadly, is my cup of tea. I’ve never met an emo work of art I couldn’t love. To no one’s surprise, I’m a big fan of Counting Crows and Dashboard Confessional too.
The Hephaestus line about working late made me laugh out loud. I used to use sections of Edith Hamilton’s Mythology when I taught high school English and the divide between the kids who immediately got that joke and the ones who had to have it explained to them was always funny.
Thanks again for listening! I really look forward to the feedback from you and Mrs. Super Captain.
Never gotten into Dashboard Confessional, but I am a big fan of Counting Crows especially August and Everything After.
I really want to be reading along with the podcast, as that’s my usual habit, but I just haven’t had time to start. However, it’s also equally telling that I can follow the story and picture so much of it in my head, meaning I re-read these issues a lot! That says something about this series or about me, not sure which.
The beheading of Deimos was another moment that clearly showed this is NOT Pre-Crisis Diana. She will clearly use lethal force when needed, but not lightly. That’s what makes her interesting. She’s not a Punisher or Wolverine where that’s SOP, nor a Superman or Captain America who avoids it at all costs. Diana exhausts all other options first, and would rather not, but is perfectly capable of striking finally. I also wonder if her life with gods and afterlifes being present in her day-to-day give her a different perspective on killing. Hmmm.
I do think making Etta so serious is a miss, but I get that the creatives were trying to get readers to take the entire cast seriously. It just went a little too far. I would have preferred keeping a plus-sized Etta who was funny, and not made fun of, if that distinction makes sense. Also, it’s hard to tell if that Etta would have fit in this issue’s battle, but it could have been amazing contrast to have her deal with the serious, and come out of it cracking wise.
You know, it’s sort of unbalanced that Sean has to give a truth every single month. So ok. As a kid and thru college, I could not eat fish with bones in them. They freaked me out. As an adult, I’ve gotten so I can very occasionally do so, albeit painfully slowly. It honestly made me reluctant to eat any seafood because the odor would trigger that reaction, but that I did get over. Also, I could eat fish sticks no problem. Because consistency is for chumps!
Oh Hawk & Dove. I only know Don from Who’s Who and Crisis, so I don’t know if I like him or not because most of my info is filtered thru Hank’s perspective which is very biased. But Dawn is fantastic, and that mini + ongoing series are delightful.
How did this feedback get so long? And yeah, still haven’t reread the issue?
Tim! Thanks for listening and writing in. I know you have the play this month, so taking the time to write in means a lot.
I actually love the dichotomy of Diana as gentle, loving friend and fierce warrior. She is the hero I would most want trying to save me if I were in danger, but the one I would be most afraid to fight.
I am so happy that you shared a truth! I totally get the fish with bones thing. Yuck!
Sean, your show is so damn good. You make the rest of us look bad.
So proud to be a part of Ryan’s least favorite comic coverage. And did I notice that he didn’t even mention my involvement? No I did not.
Paul!
Thank you so much for the kind words. That is high praise coming from you.
And I was waiting for Ryan to bring up Night Force as a lesser favorite. I always thought that, like me and Greg with Secret Wars II, the podcasting and partnership were awesome, even if the content wasn’t always so good.
Thanks for listening and writing in!
Great show, Sean and Ryan. Wow, some piping hot takes right out of the gate! I respect Ryan for admitting his terrible taste in cars, and I’m 100% on board with Sean’s coffee take. I never liked the smell or taste. Yet, because I work from home, I often take my laptop over to a local coffee shop to work and get out of the house. Most places have gotten good about having various non-coffee drinks to appease those of us who can’t stand that hot garbage. I bet cats like coffee.
Sometimes the engrossing conversation on this podcast doesn’t leave as much time for art talk – not a criticism, the conversations are great – so let me say how awesome Perez is once again. From the amazing (if not sea-worthy) bone ship, to the intricate design of the hell realm, to the lived-in details of Julia’s tax shelter winter home (there’s gotta be a meth den downstairs), Perez goes all out. Masterful work.
I don’t remember how things go for Etta in this series, but since she’s already been knocked out and buried alive, she seems to be on the Vanessa path to homicidal maniac.
Brett,
Thanks for taking time to zero in on the art. To be honest, I’m such a die hard Perez fan that I worry sometimes that the show will just be me waxing his car over and over (not that he doesn’t deserve the praise).
Also, “I bet cats like coffee” killed me. Too funny!
Another WONDERFUL episode! And I adore that you are giving some rookie podcasters a try as your guests. That Ryan Daly kid was entertaining and might make something of himself some day!
Great Secret Questions as always. On the question about family and fandoms… back around the year 2002, I was stunned when my nearly-60 year old step-mother just casually mentioned that her favorite TV series at the time was BIRDS OF PREY. Wha-Wha-What?!? She had never expressed any interest in our superhero nonsense. And THAT show? I dug it, but it was not known universally as hitting that 60 year old female demographic. Did not see that one coming!
Regarding Coffee (or lack of interest in coffee), right there with ya brother. Can’t stand coffee and I think the obsession with it is a bizarre society norm that has developed for no good reason. I’m a black tea drinker myself, but I can’t fathom making it an essential part of my cultural experience. Starbucks? Star-schmucks.
Favorite pop culture heroes stopping Armageddon? Gotta be the pilot for MISFITS OF SCIENCE! The fate of the world comes down to a short white guy making a basketball-style jump shot!! Oh… and Courtney Cox. That too. Always that.
Another Five Golden Lasso Stars episode!
What happens when you pick up a random guest in a bar.
Shag,
Thanks for writing in! I love hearing your answer to the secret questions.
A sixty year old fan of Birds of Prey is remarkable! To this day, I have still not seen that show. Maybe I need to check it out.
I, too, am a drinker of iced tea and it is far superior to coffee.
I knew you would somehow sneak a Misfits of Science reference in at some point!
Just decided to check this episode out.
When I heard the question about passing down fandoms. Well my aunt Terri got me in to Doctor who and I got my brother in to Dark shadows .
As for Wonder Woman she’s always one of my brothers favorites along with supergirl . I’ve always bin more of a flash and green lantern and Batman guy but . I thought I’d give this show a shot .
Also here’s a secret question for everyone
1. If one of wonder woman’s foes took control of
Of a golden age female hero who would they choose ? (I didn’t say who the foe is cause I don’t know rouges gallery well unuff sorry .)