Rob welcomes a who’s who of network all-stars–The Irredeemable Shag, Ryan Daly, Chris Franklin, Paul Kien, Shawn M. Myers, Max Romero, and Brett Young–to discuss the brand-new JUSTICE LEAGUE OF AMERICA #200 facsimile edition!
Check out images from this comic by clicking here!
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Congratulations, this episode went straight to the top of my currently overflowing podcast queue, and it exceeded expectations.
Years ago at a convention, I had the opportunity to ask George Perez if he would ever want to do any artwork for a Treasury-sized edition. Not surprisingly, he said he had been asked this question before. His answer was that he kind of preferred not to be told beforehand if he was drawing for a Treasury size, because he’d feel compelled to add even more detail than usual.
I was amused at his self-awareness, and found it almost disturbing to imagine how he possibly could add more than his usual amount of detail.
Rob there are 2 black marks on this book Hawkgirl gone & Snapper Carr in the book.
Agreed. Considering that Superman and Batman appear in about 3 or 4 other comics each monthly – using the World’s Finest continuity as an excuse to keep Shayera out of this all-star legancy celebration is a true travesty.
I’m probably on record somewhere here on this site about how much I, too, love this issue – it’s so damn perfect. For me, it almost caps off “my era” of the JLA – which is similar to Rob’s, in that I started reading in earnest with #171 (the JSA crossover featuring the murder of Mr. Terrific), but pretty much stopped after the crossover with All Star Squadron about a dozen issues later. And yes, it’s about damn time this one got the treasury treatment.
As for your suggestions for potential future issues getting the treasury upgrade – I almost exploded before Chris *finally* said Showcase 100! Come on – that should be the first one on everyone’s list after JLA 200!
Also, I forgot who suggested it, but the ‘Bat Murderer’ story from Detective #444-447 is a great suggestion, although it’s worth mentioning that it did already get the digest treatment back in the day – specifically Best of DC Blue Ribbon Digest #9 (which I have).
As for my own suggestions, I’d say Batman Annual #8, with all of that lovely art by von Eeden with Lynn Varley’s lovely colors, is a pretty obvious choice. And since Shag opened the door for Marvel, more than anything else I think X-men Annual #3, aka, the best annual ever (featuring art by Perez and Austin), is another obvious choice.
Great conversation, everyone, I thoroughly enjoyed it.
it was pretty good and the first time I ever saw Batman totally clown other heroes. Even superman only fought one guy
Recently I was on Shagg’s show and told him that I’d bought JLA #100 at a Rexall drugstore in my hometown when I was 9. As I listened, I remembered that I’d also bought JLA #200 – at the same store – when I was 18! Albeit, the reason I was in the store was different – I’d injured myself earlier in the day when I accidentally inserted my hand in the fold of a roll-up car wash door and had to go for stitches. Then I went to the Rexall for pain killers, gauze bandages and some ointment – because I had to go work on a pipeline the next day. Boom. There she was. Without shame or any amount of guilt, this young oilfield worker threw the comic on the counter along with the medic supplies. I read it that night very eagerly and it took my mind off the pain for a little while. I’m sure that I re-read it several times over within the next week. While I was very familiar with Perez – I think that this was the first time that I’d ever seen a “Jam” style comic, with so many disparate artists working on the same story int eh same issue … and I tried to think of a time that had happened previously to this issue. I can’t place one, so perhaps this is a pioneering concept in that way as well.
Darn. I forgot to place my suggestion for a Treasury, if I haven’t done it before.
The Archie Goodwin-Walt Simonson “Manhunter” saga from Detective Comics in 1973-1974 deserves an expanded look in this format.
Fantastic episode! I loved the discussion of the individual artists and how they drew their pet characters.
It’s funny because I always think of Aparo as a Batman artist first. In my mind he should have drawn that section, but that would have made more sense later in the 1980s after his lengthy Batman run.
I’d love to know what modern-day artists we would pick for sections. For example, I would pick:
1. Flash – Scott Kollins
2. Superman – Dan Mora
3. Wonder Woman – Nikola Scott
4. Martian Manhunter – Javier Rodriguez
5. Batman – Jorge Jimenez or Mikel Janin
6. Aquaman – John Timms
7. Green Lantern – Ivan Reis
1. Flash–Francis Manapul or perhaps Gavin Guidry
2. Superman–Gary Frank
3. Wonder Woman–Nicola Scott
4. Martian Manhunter–Kevin Maguire
5. Batman–Joelle Jones
6. Aquaman–Paul Pelletier
7. Green Lantern–Ivan Reis
Oh, I enjoy when the gang all gets together like this episode. Yes, please find excuses-uh-reasons to do it every year!
While I’m a lifelong comic reader, I wasn’t buying new comics yet when JLA #200 was on the stands. I jumped in midway thru JL Detroit. But I did read this issue a few years back during my JLA-a-day reading project. It did not disappoint, and I see why it’s so beloved. Absolutely merits the treasury format.
I would add Supergirl and Batgirl to the notable absences. Course that list is getting pretty crowded now, so I’m not that bothered. Sure, George would have made it work, but if Gerry wanted more guest stars or cameos, he’d have done it, And I ain’t no writer, so whadda I know?
Congrats on making this treasury happen, Rob, and happy anniversary F&W!
I don’t mean to be a stinker, but Hawkgirl’s absence from this issue has never bothered me. Her abilities are so similar to Katar’s that her presence would be somewhat superfluous. I prefer when one spouse or the other is on the roster.
A Treasury that will never be, but I’d like to see is a multi-issue set devoted to Camelot 3000.
1 you know who should have showed up Saron he was in an Alarming number of random JLA
2 THE MEMbers in 200 ARE PRetty my jla
3 as an 8 year old who’s first JLA WAS 200 snapper WAS cool an 8 year says “Aw yeah he seems like a normal dude clearly their settingj snapping? SONIC POWERS!
Loved this episode hearing the gang all together. Amazing.
I bought it off the rack and loved it 1000%, still owning that dog-eared copy. Back then, as a kid, I was also floored by Bolland’s art, my introduction to him. But I have to say I was just a kid and didn’t appreciate the art of Kubert, Giordano, and Infantino. Now I am a little smarter and appreciate those pages way more. In fact, I think Kubert’s pages are glorious.
A couple more comments.
Like Shag, I have strong memories associated with this group. There is a college next to the hospital and I was sitting on an outside staircase when Shag asked me to joing the Legion of Super-Bloggers and we agreed that I’d cover the 5YL stuff. I can’t walk past that place without remembering that conversation.
I love that “The Insecticons are in our way”/ “No, they’re our way in” lines, my favorite lines from The Transformers Movie, remain in Rob’s mind and lexicon! Amazing!
I will wholly second the Goodwin/Simonson Manhunter as a tremendous Treasury idea. I was thinking of a ‘DC Simonson’ treasury myself – first issue of Manhunter, first issue of Orion, and his take on the Sand Superman story in the Superman Special from years ago. But my second thought was the first 4 issues of the Morrison/Porter JLA with the war against the White Martians. A more modern story to lure the kids in.
Rock on Fire & Water!
I will echo the choice of Showcase #100 for a treasury. It already is a giant-sized book in my memory. I bought Justice League #200 off the rack and the Satellite-era League was my team. My first issue was #159 w/ the historical characters (Jonah Hex, Enemy Ace, etc.) as guest stars and was a regular reader till the end.
I’m so pleased you got this episode out so quickly Rob, my copy of the JLA #200 Limited Collectors Edition arrived only last week and I love it. I bought the original at the time and it was an extra-magical issue of a magical run.
I was dazzled by the introduction from the comic, having Gerry be part of the show was so special – excellent planning, Rob!
I’ve seen a fair bit of negativity on Facebook about tiny little production details with the reissue, but all DC could do was the best they could with what they’ve got. I’m really grateful they offered us this gift and to my eyes it looks sensational. One thing, could you please explain ‘vectoring’? I’ve looked it up, read the details, and just don’t understand how it’s different to ‘upsizing art’
Rob, I’m with Shagg, I don’t consider Barry and Zee to have been lovers – they had that meagre dinner off trays in JLA #187, there was an implied snog, Zee arrived home the next day and thought about how they’d talked all night, and later that day – JLA #188 – Barry basically said they’d just be good friends.
It was great to see the members’ original artists return to their classic characters, but wouldn’t it be interesting if DC had been inspired by the classic JLA twist of swapping villains and had everyone draw everyone else else’s characters?
I get the point about most of the artists in this issue being veterans, but Brian Bolland wasn’t a newbie– he’d been drawing professionally for 10 years, starting with a character called Powerman in Nigeria.
A dream treasury? Superman #400, so many superstars contributing to a fabulous anthology of stories and pin-ups.
Anyway, thanks for a wonderful episode, Network All-Stars, I look forward to more episodes of Treasurycast – The Gravy.
Martin, “vectoring” is converting non-scalable or “raster” art into pixels that can then be scaled up without losing resolution. Most artists/designers use Adobe Illustrator to create vector artwork. In the case of comics, if the work was created in traditional pencils and inks, you have to scan or photograph the original art or a printed example, then run it through a process in Illustrator or another program to reinterpret the artwork as vector. You invariably lose some detail such as fine lines, lines sometimes glob together, etc.
Hope that helps!
Thanks Chris, I’m a bit closer! I may need to see a video…
What a fun podcast, thank you. Amazing job having so many of you being so passionate without it being an unintelligible clusterfuck.
I love this comic and have ever since I bought it as a back issue in 1987. (A couple times a year when I was a kid, my parents would let me go nuts on the back issue bins at NYC’s famous Forbidden Planet, and I remember the epic day this was part of my haul.) I reread it about once a year, and can’t wait to do so again once I get me hands on a copy of the treasury version (how did I not know this existed till now?)
You guys even called out the only two things I dislike about this story:
— Firestorm not knowing who the Martian Manhunter is (though you did an excellent job no-prizing it)
— Hawkwoman’s total absence. I’m I crazy, but was there a letter a few issues later lamenting her omission, which was written as if it were from Shayera’s POV?
Let me second the request to make a treasury of Detective 526, the special issue where Batman fights nearly his entire rogues gallery, Jason Todd becomes Robin, and Don Newton’s art kicks all the ass (imagine seeing Signalman’s costume in treasury size!). Rob, here’s my request to be a guest on the Treasurycast episode covering this theoretical release.
As for my (other) pick—speaking of Perez, speaking of the JLA, speaking of Signalman—that killer JLA-JSA team-up shortly before JLA #200 in which they fought the Secret Society of Super Villains. But frankly, at this point, I’m ready to buy nearly any treasury that reprints a DC story from my personal golden era (late ’70s through mid-’90s). Better go out and buy a copy of this one so that they keep making them.
0) The leveling on this episode was legitimately painful. I was listening in my car, at near full volume (as demanded by the CLA-ssic FW formula,) and I had to keep a hand at the ready to turn the volume up and down rapidly depending on who was talking, or how loudly (Rob was extra excited, unsurprisingly.) If my timing was off or I needed both hands on the wheel, I got stabbed in the eardrums.
1) Yeah, I was immediately annoyed with the cover bars. It was so clunky, low effort and amateurish. There was a period earlier in the century when a lot of school supplies were using recycled comics covers, and it reminded me of those cheapjack Trapper Keeper things. I much preferred the floating heads suggestion, and I think Perez did enough of those for other JLofA covers that you could have pulled together a reflective line-up.
2) While I had some exposure to Justice League of America through the newsstand and other comics, I never bought an issue until the Bwah-Ha-Ha JLI (“Moving Day” specifically.) I watched Super Friends, and I had some cognitive dissonance over how the JLofA related to them (or the Super Powers Team, when that branding came into use.) Then I had aesthetic dissonance when I’d pick up a George Perez cover and see George Tuska art under it, followed by line-up dissonance in the Detroit Era with heroes that even with hindsight affection are clearly D-List. Plus, even though JLI was the first League that I ever followed, it remained obvious that they were a kooky deviation, not a “real” incarnation.
My JLA is Morrison/Porter/Waid, beginning with “Midsummer’s Nightmare,” but really spiking with JLA #1 and the Magnificent Seven talking in logos. That was the iconic, platonic League that I’d been waiting to meet since the ’70s. That’s what sent me to the back issue bins, and in the case of #200, had me setting aside choice books for myself when one of my customers started bringing his Bronze Age JLofA for trade credit. I had no significant prior exposure to #200 before snagging his copy, and I was old enough to fully appreciate which artists contributed to an actually attractive looking period story. I was too old to fixate on it with the childish glee of those who were there for it on the stands, but I could see that it was a too rare example of how wonderfully the concept could be realized.
3) My favorite splash of many swell ones is Green Arrow/Black Canary/Batman (in that order.) I only own one of those “life size” 11″x17″ artist editions of raw original comic art scans, and it’s the Brian Bolland one with Killing Joke and other stories (including this page.) It’s one of the finest renderings of Ollie specifically, by one of my favorite artists.
4) My favorite match-up is Manhunter from Mars versus Firestorm, because it’s the first, and because I have such a personal investment in J’Onn J’Onzz, especially in this period. All of the other featured heroes were routinely appearing in Justice League and their own solo stories, but I can count every Alien Atlas appearance from the previous dozen years on my fingers. He was a literal blast from the past, shocking the new hotness that was Firestorm, dazzlingly rendered by Pat Broderick and Terry Austin. I think it had to have made an impression on young readers, and might have contributed to his reinstatement a few years later (which led to his Super Powers figure and my making its acquaintance.)
When you guys were talking about what DC Treasuries you’d like to dream into existence, one particular story came to my own mind that is almost certainly completely impossible:
Corona – the lost Firestorm graphic novel.
It’s probably impossible, of course, because so far as I know, not only was the project never completed (and thus couldn’t be in the archives to pull out), but the script probably no longer exists (I gather from some of Shag’s research elsewhere that it must have been completed at some point, and I do know that Pat Broderick did at least some art), and I’m really not interested in seeing it written by anyone other than the late, great, Gerry Conway. (I’m fine when Big Finish does that kind of thing for the occasional entry in their Doctor Who: The Lost Stories line, but this would really need to be Conway’s original for me to care)
I’d be okay with modern artists (I’m open to discussion as to whether they should attempt to replicate 80’s era art styles), but if Pat Broderick were up to completing it, even better!
Rob, I was listening to this episode on my commute when my dashcam recorded an interesting event. So a snippet of your show ended up being published on the Dashcam Lessons channel. Today’s episode (8/24/26), clip #4. Your fame knows no bounds!
When you asked about other comics we’d like to see as a Treasury I reflexively shouted “LEGION 300!”
Also (since you said we didn’t have to worry about how likely it could happen): Somehow try to recreate Starlin’s original plans for the Legion’s ‘Omega Saga’.