It’s a holiday spotlight episode of JSA in the 90s covering two short stories from 1997! Noah Tarnow and The Irredeemable Shag discuss, “I Left My Heart at the Justice Society Canteen” from DCU HOLIDAY BASH II, written by Howard Chaykin with art by Rick Burchett! Then Ryan Daly stops by to chat about, “Spirit of the Season” with Wesley Dodds Sandman from VERTIGO WINTER’S EDGE #1, written by Matt Wagner & Steven Seagle with art by John K Snyder III! Plus, we wrap up with YOUR listener feedback!
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Shag: I’m very excited, very, very excited.
Noah: yes
Happy holidays guys!
Lovely episode, dudes. One note: The anachronisms get worse when you consider Black Canary debuted in 1947 and wasn’t active as criminal-turned-hero or as a JSAer until after the War. One note plus: The JSA was said to have their HQ in Civic City in a story in ALL-STAR COMICS #47 (1949). The Gotham City thang came later, as did the retconning/mistake of Canary being a wartime JSAer.
The Black Canary of it all slightly bugged me at the time but it’s such a great story. Were we ever specifically told after the Crisis that Dinah still debuted post-war? Maybe she was moved forward, but because we didn’t get much in the way of post-Crisis All-Star Squadron stories, we never saw her in action with the team. What Howard Chaykin should have done was have a teenage, pre-Black Canary, Dinah Drake working as a waitress (‘in a cocktail bar…) or, if it was heroines-only serving, as a hatcheck girl, and teaming up with young Jim to foil the baddies.
I did like the reference to ‘Peoria’, a place I’d heard of only in the ‘It’s a Bird, It’s a plane, It’s Superman’ in the song ‘You’ve Got Possibilities’.
In the All-Star Companion, (don’t remember which issue) , Thomas outlined some ideas he was thinking of using if the book had continued as intended. He wanted to turn Rick Cannon into Cap Cannon. A Doc Savage type analogue. Probably with a bit of Captain America thrown in.
He intended to have a stowaway on Wonder Woman’s ship when she returned to Earth from hyperspace. A Crystal creature called Krysallis.
He also wanted to retcon Dinah Drake as a teenage crime fighter, but using a different name. As he did for the original Huntress when he retconned her as the Tigress in Young All-Stars.
Thanks Hal, glad Roy never did that last one! Not that what we did get was marvelous…
Excellent episode! As long as the content is enjoyable, the shows can be as long as you care to edit. And I say this as someone who listened to the entire DC Sampler episode!
Johnny Thunder did indeed meet the Marvel Family in my all-time favorite issue, Justice League of America #137.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rQ3A6xwq2_xCUjny_KmQmM3e9kY108uj/view?usp=drive_link
Hey Super Captain – This is for you, from your question last episode!!
Thanks, Ted and Shag! That issue of Justice League looks great and I will have to check it out.
Great episode Shag, Noah, and Ryan! As the “Go to Jew” for the Fire and Water Podcast Network, I was especially excited that you covered the moving Sandman story.
For some context, Kaddish (pronounced Kah-dish) refers to the Mourner’s Kaddish, which is a prayer recited at every service and also at funerals. The prayer is said to both commemorate the deceased and to make the mourners aware that they are surrounded by their community and that their mourning is shared amongst all of the Jewish people.
This is especially lovely for the story because both Wesley and the older woman are grieving and find some solace in knowing that the grief of one person is the grief of all.
For a Jewish person, hearing and reciting the Kaddish automatically brings some powerful emotions, as it is a way to focus our thoughts on those no longer with us.
Famously, Alan Ginsburg used the cadence of the Mourner’s Kaddish as the template for his seminal poem “Howl”. (“I saw the best minds of my generation destroyed by madness, starving hysterical naked…”)
Thanks for covering both wonderful stories and especially for including one from the Jewish tradition.
Sean
Great show, Shag, Noah, and Ryan! As far as favorite holiday stories, obviously JSA #54-55 makes my list. Perfect Thanksgiving and Christmas goodness back to back. I also have a soft spot for the Teen Titans “A Swingin’ Christmas Carol” that was reprinted in a digest when I was a kid. And I will always remember Power Pack #19, a special Thanksgiving issue that featured the Power kids having Thanksgiving w/ Wolverine, Kitty Pryde, Beta Ray Bill, and Leech and Annalee from the Morlocks.
Shag, I will have to find and read that story in which Aquaman is one of the Magi.
And as far as live-action versions of The Golden Age, would you count the final season of a certain CW show set in Blue Valley?
Happy holidays to everyone at Fire and Water! You make the season more joyful indeed.
In the Golden Harlaquin gives Back what she steals she just really liked being chased.
Fun fact: The addition of Mary Marvel was a last-minute art adjustment. It was originally Betsy Ross in the original drawing but had to be adjusted due to Ross not being actively in continuity at that point.
Hard to believe that Betsy Ross was in development for that long. She didn’t debut until 2023. But I suppose not impossible.
Don’t know when the changeover happened, but by their return in the seventies, the JSA were very much in Gotham. What with Alan running a Gotham TV station and Brue being the commissioner on Earth-2!
I’m sure all the classics have already been covered so I’ll go with the first Christmas comic I remember reading. The UK Marvel’s had an issue, #14, where Jazz is saved from Circuit Breaker (the Marvel character) thanks to the power of Christmas! Not saying it’s an amazing issue but it sits in my warm fuzzies!
Which Marvel UK comic was that? Never heard of Jazz, though Circuit Breaker rings a vague bell.
I’ve lots of favourite Chrimbo stories, but today it’s Superman #462, the Daily Planet copy girl Alice issue.
I think Symbol Pending is referencing Jazz from the Transformers. There were a number of Transformers UK Comics with Christmas covers…. I recall Optimus Prime wearing a Santa Cloak/hood – which made me wonder who made that scale of a Santa outfit?
Aha, thanks Doug, I’ve never read a Transformers comic, or seen a film, or a cartoon, or a toy actually.
Regarding my favorite holiday story, I have to cheat and pick out an entire issue: DC Special Series #21, a dollar comic cover dated April 1980. It’s the Super Star Holiday Special, and features a great mix of characters including Batman, Sgt. Rock, Jonah Hex, Cain and Abel, Phantom Stranger — ***BOOM**** A huge pasty biker guy just crashed through my ceiling!!! There’s also a bulldog and even some penguins!!! Oh no!!! Shag, I need to change my choice to the Lobo Paramilitary Christmas Special –AAAAARGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Another great episode! It’s safe to say, anything that has Shags voice talking to me about comic books, I’m gonna enjoy listening to. Keep up the great work and boo Gators, go Noles.
Impressive podcast most Impressive. I’ll have more to say latter. But, cool to see a Christmas Episode so Merry . And her at a military Dance. Anyway can’t wait for the next episode.
Regards – DCU HOLIDAY BASH II
I am shocked, SHOCKED!, that the time line doesn’t work out properly for the Jim Gordon revelation in this short story. I mean this is COMICS people, the one true medium that never messes up with timelines and… sorry what’s that? I’ve just been told that COMICS are actually the worse abusers of time line shenanigans – Spider-man is a prime example? Okay boomer…Wait Peter Parker is a Boomer who knew?
Anyway thanks for a great episode and excellent work by Shag to manage to once again to get great guests hosts and then put them on the wrong story covered in the book. May the lessons of not getting JT The Exterminator on the GIANT MOUSE story from JLA 80-Page Giant remain unlearned.
I’ve not read the Sandman Mystery Theatre series but I think it’s now on my reading list (along with Starman) after the coverage in this episode.
As for the big surprise for next month to Celebrate the JSA 85th birthday all I can say is if this is Shag jumping out of a cake I’m not interested and also it’s a waste of cake.
Impressive podcast most impressive. Ah so it was Jim Gordon. Cool. Sounds like a cool Christmas issue. Also yeah I can see Ted not putting up with bullies. Cool seeing all them together. Hmm, it be great to see the first Harlequin with a new romance. Glad Allen loves her. But yeah it will always be a platonic love and that’s cool. Just yeah her meeting some one new…. Why not Wild Cat?
The two of them could be a power couple. As she hangs with her brother from another mother Allen Scott. Yeah Garden is a bit of a boy Scott. But it works for him. Could see him saying language as Hawkman uses colorful metaphors in battle. Geez Star Man? Black Canary and Star Man ? Ah well. Her daughter does date Green Arrow. So nether of them have great taste in men…. Save Jim Gordon good choice by her. Wait in the last continuity, I read Babd is Jim’s bio daughter.
Wait now I want the else ware story ware Canary and Babs are sisters. Maybe Cannery can teach Babs Gordon how to dress. What the woman makes Elton John look like a fashion expert. Sorry Stella , but I’m right. Babs and Kitty Pride are Queens of bad fashion. Hmm hour man at the end cool
The Christmas story with the sand man is cool too. Any way Meryy Christmas, happy Hanukkah, happy Kwanzaa and Gloria celebrations of all kinds with reason.
Loved the episode earlier this week and just now got the chance to write.
One holiday story that stands out on my mind for some reason wasn’t even released in December. The second story in Justice League of America, released in March of 1981, is essentially a Hannukah story. The Hawks are on the Satellite when it’s damaged by a malfunctioning defense satellite. Batman, Black Canary, and the Atom respond to the mayday and are all stranded with life support failing.
I’m not sure why it was published 3 months after the holiday, but growing up in a small town in the south there weren’t too many non-Christians. The sequence where Ray and Jean attend a Hannukah party was a great primer to that tradition.
And before I forget, I hope everyone is having a wonderful holiday season!
Happy holidays to one and all
And heard Jay Garrick shout as he ran out site
Merry Christmas and happy holidays to all and to all a good night.
This was a fun episode and I really enjoyed going back to these stories, which I hadn’t read since they first came out. I don’t think I would have ever pegged the JSA tale as written by Howard Chaykin if I didn’t look at the credits – it seems much sweeter than his usual fare (and yes, I know there was a Nazi plot, but otherwise). Totally didn’t see the Jim Gordon reveal coming either and in complete agreement about the Black Canary of it all. Heck, I would have almost expected Chaykin to have written the Sandman feature.
I’d like to nominate DC Comics Presents #67 (Superman and Santa Claus) and Batman and the Outsiders #8 as holiday issues that have stuck with me over the years.
I can’t believe I missed a story that referred to Peoria, Illinois. I grew up near Peoria, so I’m embarrassed as heck.
Forgot to add that my favorite holiday story will always be “Should Auld Acquaintance Be Forgot” in Christmas with the Super-Heroes #2 (1989). “My name is Kara. Though I doubt that’ll mean anything to you.” Hits me in the feelz every time.
The DCU Holiday Bash has so many great stories, but the JSA one is the tops, with all of the cameo appearances and so much heart. I’m sure this story is supposed to be in post-Crisis continuity, but it has enough things that don’t fit, I’m happy to view it as fitting in “just to the left”. But my favorite head canon is maybe Commissioner Gordon’s father was also named Jim, and that’s who appears in this story. Without a doubt, this story fits somewhere in the DC multiverse, because it’s too good not to.
Wonderful episode, gents!
Great episode gents! I know there will be teeth gnashing when this is read, but part of me was half-expecting for this to set up a storyline in Birds of Prey where Dinah (the second) and Barbara come to the realization they may be half-sisters…or half-cousins I guess based on Jim being Barbara’s bilogical uncle at the time. Yes, I wondered if someone at DC wasn’t going to reveal Jim and not Larry Lance was the father of Black Canary 2!
But I’ve always loved that story, and Rick Burchett is a phenomenal artist who never gets enough praise. I believe he worked on the Blackhawk series that sprung out of that Chaykin mini, right?
I have never read the Sandman story, but it was very touching. I’ll be honest, as young adult, I didn’t care for Guy Davis’ art, and that kept me from reading Sandman Mystery Theater. But I’m over that now, and really need to track down the series and read it as a whole. I gotta track down that Aquaman story too!
Second favorite DC Christmas story is the infamous Deadman story that got Mark Waid fired, but my all-time nymber one is “The Man Who Murdered Santa Claus” from
JLA #110. A super-hero riff on “And then there were none”, , the second appearance of John Stewart as Green Lantern, and a new costume for the Red Tornado, proving that the jazzercize outfit from the 80s wasn’t a fluke, Black Canary really is a terrible designer.
I’m late, but enjoyed both segments thoroughly. I want to specifically shout out Shag and Ryan’s recommendations in the second half – I remember both those stories with a lot of fondness. I was a GenX reader too, and even remember the TV pilot with some kindness.
Late getting here but it’s interesting how while the jewish aspec they paid close attention to many details but appeared to get a few thing wrong also. The menorah is fully lit in one of the first panels showing it marking the last day of Hanukkah. However later The rabbi is lighting it correctly from left to right (candles get put in right to left) but it is showing that it’s day 6 of Hanukkah with two days left. However weirdly while he is lighting the menorah he doesn’t appear to be lighting it with the shamash candle because it’s clearly unlit. On the other hand again the rabbi is wearing a Tefillin which makes sense. So it’s weird the religious practices inconsistencies.
Also where is the menorah in that synagoge?
Hi Sontaron – Thanks for the observations! Interesting thoughts and questions.
Just wanted to let you know I’ve already recorded the feedback for the next episode, so sorry this won’t make it into the episode. But I appreciate you listening and commenting!